What do you think?

[akjforever]

This was posted on another forum, someone replied to me:

Kirtanis should be informed that " Nomore" hindi songs tunes and come back to Gurus Gurmat sangeet which is based on purely on Ragas.

Here is article for you AKJ-Forever. And AKJ Kirtan is pure Manmat.

Taken from: http://www.sikhreview.org/may2002/music.htm

Musical Framework of Guru Granth Sahib

Amardeep Singh*

Gurbani Keertan today has been commercialized to such an extent that, barring a few, most singers are only concerned with making quick money. Their limitations to experiment within the prescribed vastness of Guru Granth Sahib is camouflaged in the excuse that the Sangat does not prefer to listen to Keertan in Raags as prescribed by the Gurus and thus it is easier to convey the message of Gurbani in catchy tunes. This shallow argument poses questions, like: "What does Guru Granth Sahib, our eternal Guru command us on the subject of Keertan? Why is it that the Gurus chose raags to classify Gurbani? What is the relation between Shabad and raag? Do we need the aid of experimental music to propagate the message of Guru Granth Sahib? Have our Keertanias experimented with the vastness of raags and taals as prescribed by Gurus? What impact will experimentation have on the future generation of Sikhs?

Hymns in Guru Granth Sahib are in poetical-metric forms; associated with them raags and ghars (beats/taals). Does this mean that Gurus have left no scope for experimentation with the music to accompany the Shabads? The indication of raag and ghar (beat) with every Shabad implies that Gurus had a definite motive

behind fixing a framework. This framework was not set to limit the ability of the human mind to experiment with music but to act as an aid in spiritual development. A simple mathematical permutation and combination on notes of any raag will indicate that each raag offers thousands of tunes to experiment with.

Complementary:

Poetry (the form in which Gurbani is written) and music (raags) are two sides of the same coin. They are independent and yet complement each other. Music versifies and provides melody, uniformity and cadence to poetry. The factor that binds music and poetry is their metrical-form (ghar or beat). Music (Raag) is based on sound (swar - notes) and a combination of notes produce distinct musical effects. Poetry is determined by Word (Shabad), which communicates a message to the mind. Music (Raag) on the other hand conveys a feeling to the heart and is therefore universal. Spirituality, after all, is striking the right balance between mind and heart. Therefore, when the poetic Gurbani is complemented with raag (music) and bound by ghar (beat), the resulting effect on mind and heart can become a catalyst for spiritual transformation. The raag conveys a feeling and Shabad a message. Every raag is capable of touching the heart with feelings like joy, sorrow, detachment, etc. Upon studying the structure of Guru Granth Sahib it can be seen that Shabads relating to common themes are generally placed under each raag. When the broad themes of Shabads are overlaid with feelings conveyed by these raags, there emerges a reason behind grouping of Shabads under a broad classification of thirty-one raags.

Common Themes of Shabads placed under Raags of Guru Granth Sahib

1. Soohi - Being away from home. The soul being away from the House of Lord and the joy of meeting the true ‘husband.’

2. Bilaaval - beautification of soul, happiness.

3. Gaund - Separation, union, surprise.

4. Sri - Maya and detachment

5. Maajh - yearning to merge with Lord, giving up of negative values.

6. Gauri -

Principles, serious, thoughtfulness, composed

7. Aasa - Hope

8. Gujri - Prayer (Pooja)

9. Devgandhari - Merging with spouse, self - realization

10. Bihaagra - Yearning due to separation of soul and happiness due to meeting the Lord.

11. Sorath - Merits of God

12. Dhanasari - Mixed theme

13. Jaitsree - Stability

14. Todi - Maya, separation

15. Bairagi - motivation to sing praises of Lord

16. Tilang - many words from the vocabulary of Islamic origin are used, sadness, beautification.

17. Raamkali - to give up the life of a wandering Jogi.

18. Nat Narayan - Joy of meeting the Lord

19. Maali Gaura - Happiness

20. Maaru - Bravery, profound philosophy.

21. Tukhari - Separation and union with Lord

22. Kedara - Love

23. Bhairav - Man’s state of hell

24. Basant - Happiness

25. Sarang - Thirst to meet God

26. Malaar - State of separated and united soul

27. Jaijawanti - Vairaag (Detachment)

28. Kalyaan - Bhakti (Prayer) Ras

29. Vadhans - Vairaag (Detachment)

30. Prabhati - Bhakti (Prayer)

31. Kaanra - Bhakti (Prayer)

Feelings communicated by the music of Raags:

1. Soohi - joy and separation

2. Bilaaval - happiness

3. Gaund - strangeness, surprise, beauty

4. Sri - satisfaction and balance

5. Maajh - separation, beautification

6. Gauri - seriousness

7. Aasa - making effort

8. Gujri - satisfaction, softness of heart, sadness

9. Devgandhari - no specific feeling but the Raag has a softness

10. Bihaagra - beautification

11. Sorath - motivation

12. Dhanasari - inspiration, motivation

13. Jaitsree - softness, satisfaction, sadness

14, Todi - this being a flexible Raag it is apt for communicating many feelings

15. Bhairaavi - sadness, (Gurus have, however, used it for the message of Bhakti)

16. Tilang - this is a favourite Raag of Sufi Muslims. It denotes feeling of beautification and yearning.

17. Raamkali - calmness

18. Nat Narayan - happiness

19. Maali Gaura

- happiness

20. Maaru - giving up of cowardice

21. Tukhari - beautification

22. Kedara - love and beautification

23. Bhairav - seriousness, brings stability of mind

24. Basant - happiness

25. Sarang - sadness

26. Malaar - separation

27. Jaijawanti – Victory (Detachment indicates a victory of spiritual plane)

28. Kalyaan - Bhakti Ras

29. Vadhans - vairaag, loss (that is why Alahniya is sung in this Raag when someone passes away)

30. Prabhati - Bhakti and seriousness

31. Kaanra - Bhakti and seriousness

It’s clear that the Gurus used raags to increase the delivery power of shabad to our mind by invoking complementary feelings in our hearts through usage of the prescribed raags.

Another interesting aspect of raag and Gurbani classification is understood by studying daily time-cycles. A raag has a preferred timing associated with it. There are some morning raags, evening raags, afternoon raags, etc. The timings of raags also complement the changes in human moods and heart during a twenty-four hour time cycle.

Upon classification of thirty-one main raags used in Guru Granth Sahib based on the prescribed raag timings, we find that no raags fall under the time zone 12 AM - 3 AM. It is interesting that the Gurus chose not to use any raag with a time cycle of 12AM – 3 AM, because one would normally sleep between 10PM - 4AM.

Timings of Raags:

6 AM - 9AM: Bhairaagi, Devgandhari

9 AM - 12 PM: Saarang, Suhi, Bilaaval, Gujri, Gond, Todi

12 PM - 3 PM: Vadhans, Maru, Dhanasari

3 PM - 6 PM: Maanjh, Gauri, Tilang, Tukhari

6 PM - 9 PM: Sri, Basant, Maali Gaura, Jaitsree, Kedara, Kalyaan

9 PM - 12 AM: Bihaagra, Nat Narayan, Sorath, Malaar, Kaanra, Jaijawanti

12 AM - 3 AM: No Raags from Guru Granth Sahib

3AM - 6AM: Aasa, Raamkali, Bhairav, Parbhati

Some raags also have seasons associated with them as seasons also denote feelings.

Seasonality of Raags:

1. Basant raag can be sung at any time in Basant season. Shabads with the theme of happine

ss are clustered under this raag in Guru Granth Sahib.

2. Malaar raag can be sung at any time in the rainy season. Shabads with the theme of separation are clustered under this raag in Guru Granth Sahib.

The Gurus have also indicated the beats associated with the poetry of every Shabad. In Guru Granth Sahib seventeen ghars (taal - beat) are mentioned. These seventeen ghars denote the following beats:

GHAR 1 - DADRA TAAL (There are 1 Taalis and the Beat has 6 Maatraas)

GHAR 2 - RUPAK TAAL (There are 2 Taalis and the Beat has 7 Maatraas)

GHAR 3 - TEEN TAAL (There 3 Taalis and the Beat has 16 Maatraas)

GHAR 4 - CHAAR TAAL (There are 4 Taalis and the Beat has 12 Maatraas)

GHAR 5 - PUNJ TAAL (There are 5 Taalis and the Beat has 15 Maatraas)

GHAR 6 - KHUT TAAL (There are 6 Taalis and the Beat has 18 Maatraas)

GHAR 7 - MUT TAAL (There are 7 Taalis and the Beat has 21 Maatraas)

GHAR 8 - ASHT MANGAL TAAL (There are 8 Taalis and the Beat has 22 Maatraas)

GHAR 9 - MOHINI TAAL (There are 9 Taalis and the Beat has 23 Maatraas)

GHAR 10 - BRAHAM TAAL (There are 10 Taalis and the Beat has 28 Maatraas)

GHAR 11 - RUDRA TAAL (There are 11 Taalis and the Beat has 32 Maatraas)

GHAR 12 - VISHNU TAAL (There are 12 Taalis and the Beat has 36 Maatraas)

GHAR 13 - MUCHKUND TAAL (There are 13 Taalis and the Beat has 34 Maatraas)

GHAR 14 - MAHASHANI TAAL (There are 14 Taalis and the Beat has 42 Maatraas)

GHAR 15 - MISHR BARAN TAAL (There are 15 Taalis and the Beat has 47 Maatraas)

GHAR 16 - KUL TAAL (There are 16 Taalis and the Beat has 42 Maatraas)

GHAR 17 - CHRCHARI TAAL (There are 17 Taalis and the Beat has 40 Maatraas)

Within the rules of Indian Classical Music, uncountable raags can be created. In fact, any form of music (non-Indian and non-classical) can be classified under some form of raag. Hence it is a misconception that raags are something highly classical and beyond the realm of the common man’s understanding. In fact, any form of music can be classified int

o a raag. But in Guru Granth Sahib, the Gurus have gone into depths of poetry, music and metrical forms to lay the framework that is best suited to convey the feeling and message of the Shabad simultaneously to the human mind and heart.

When each of the prescribed raags offers uncountable permutations and combinations of musical compositions, then why is it that modern Keertanias are not experimenting within the prescribed framework of the Gurus?

Are they camouflaging their limitations in the excuse that Sangat prefers only catchy tunes?

Gurbani says:

"Among all raags, that one is sublime, O Siblings of Destiny, by which Go

[Guest SikhForLife]

above points well taken...!! ideally thats how keertan should be done.. raags mentioned in SGGS.

me being such a liberal thinks:

- classical music has lost its appeal to this generation (my gen.)

- too much "aaah aaah" in keertan diverts my attention

- anything to sing and listen to Guru;s bani

but .. i know of a raaagi.. who Has used hindi film music while doing keertan........

personally i dont really care.. cuz it doesnt remind me of hindi songs ( i dont listen to them )

but one of my friend's was really bothered by it.. cuz everytime he would listen to that shabad it would remind him of that hindi song

[navjotsingh]

keertan is keertan. In my point of view as long as u sing it with pyar and sharda it doesnt matter how u sing as long as you singh with all ur heart

[akjforever]

Also, I know many young Sikhs, if it weren't for AKJ style kirtan, they wouldn't be listening to kirtan or doing kirtan for that matter. And along with AKJ kirtan, they wouldn't be following Sikhi, if it weren't for the influence of AKJ.

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[Guest Akaal108]

Also, I know many young Sikhs, if it weren't for AKJ style kirtan, they wouldn't be listening to kirtan or doing kirtan for that matter. And along with AKJ kirtan, they wouldn't be following Sikhi, if it weren't for the influence of AKJ.

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

you sure??? Because i see pure ahankar in your post.

Purkha akj just started while back. Has very little influence in villages of punjab. How youths there are surviving in sikhi without akj kirtan in punjab then?

[akjforever]

I am talking about America, I myself am born raised in the good ol USA, most American born Sikhs my age that I know started listening to AKJ style kirtan because of the style, which lead them to learning kirtan. I even have a friend who kept his hair after he started listening to AKJ style kirtan. I have a special place for AKJ, it has influenced my life a great deal.

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[Guest Akaal108]

I even have a friend who kept his hair after he started listening to AKJ style kirtan.

Thats vaheguroo's kirpa. Stop bringing jatha bandis into it. Yes vaheguroo used akj style kirtan for merely an step in the ladder.

Praise the creator not jatha's :umm: )

[akjforever]

I agree with your post, I am not saying AKJ is perfect and is the only way. It has had a big influence on my life, that's all. The only thing being that there are many pakhandees and anti Sikhi cults out there, one has to be careful to not be caught up in those.

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[ms514]

Sat Sri Akal:

Before we engage in some discussion, it would be important to point out some things. First, kirtan done by many of the AKJ Kirtanias is in raag. Raag is NOT singing "Sa Re Ga Ma Pa Da Ni Sa" and "aaahahaahaa" like your tail is on fire. If anything, singing this should be considered manmat, as it detracts the focus from Akal Purakh's words and turns into the Kirtania's personal show to display his/her skills (not to mention really annoy many of the sangat, who find it extremely irritating that such phrases are disturbing the blissful flow of Gurbani Kirtan). Raag is a musical scale within which to perform kirtan. Complicating and frustrating it with "Sa Re..." etc. is not necessary.

Second, before stating that "AKJ doesnot do kirtan in raag", it would be fitting for a person who knows all the raags to compare the AKJ kirtan with their respective raags listed in the Guru Granth Sahib, see if the kirtan is done according to that raag, and then make that comment. Unless someone here is an expert in raag-vidiya, I would highly recommend not making judgements on assumptions.

Thirdly, this topic has been presented on AKJ boards and they also agree. Doing Kirtan in raag is how it should be done...otherwise, the Gurus had no reason for listing the raags in which to sing kirtan in in the Guru Granth Sahib. And many of the "seasoned" Kirtanias do a lot of their Kirtan in raags (take Bhai Tejinderpal Singh for instance).

Keep these things in mind before engaging in this discussion. And forgive this poor moorakh if his words seem harsh.

[Guest learner singh]

keertan is keertan. In my point of view as long as u sing it with pyar and sharda it doesnt matter how u sing  as long as you singh with all ur heart

Let me repharase as well. Sikhi is sikhi. In my point of view as long as you are sikh with pyar and sharda it doesn't matter how you keep it as long as you keep it with all ur heart.

Now tell me if above makes me Sikh? and this is what we call manmat where you listen to your heart and disobey guru's command.