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When you merge with Waheguru. Do you still have your own mind and soul and can see and travel... or are you Waheguru (along with many others)?????

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When you go to Sachkhand you are japping naam with everyone else who has reached Sachkhand.

We are all droplets departed from the ocean. When the droplet reaches the ocean it becomes one with the ocean.

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VJKK VJKF

24 minutes ago, monatosingh said:

When you go to Sachkhand you are japping naam with everyone else who has reached Sachkhand.

We are all droplets departed from the ocean. When the droplet reaches the ocean it becomes one with the ocean.

Beautiful analogy... :waheguru: 

VJKK VJKF

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7 hours ago, GurpreetSingh13 said:

When you merge with Waheguru.

Do you still have your own mind and soul and can see and travel... or are you Waheguru (along with many others)?????

Brother,

Mind is duality, is confusion, is maya, is change, is variety, is limited, is the source of pain, is subtle matter, is not divinity....

Just as long as water is in the bottle, even if thrown in the sea,  the water in the bottle is separate from  its origin, the Sea, though there is water on all sides.

in a similar way, in order for the water to become one with the sea, the bottle has to be broken, in a similar way,  mind is only with the soul, as long as the soul is under the control of the mind.

Once the soul, is released from the mind by His apaar kirpa through Bhakti, the mind becomes helpless and powerless, thus only  releases the soul from its clutches,  then the soul rides higher and higher, in the jahaaz of Nam, and reaches Sach Khand, upon reaching there, it becomes one  with the only one original and permanent existing reality, which is none other than Wahiguru Akal Purukh.

Just as all the rivers flow and merge in the Ocean, to become one with it without any distinction, so do all souls do upon reaching there, means merging in Him.

Souls do not go there for vacation, or sightseeing, or attending a musical concert, or give it any name ...But souls yearn to go there, for it is their origin, where once they were one with Him, without any second, third  or multiplicity.

For there only Wahiguru exists. Sach Khand vaseh Nirankar

5 hours ago, GurpreetSingh13 said:

means destruction of soul

There is no such destruction of the soul.

For the soul being a particle of the Ocean, holds all the same virtues/qualities, as the Ocean has; that of divinity, of Sach, of chit, of Anand, of immortality.

If the soul was not of the same nature as Him, it could never become one with Him.

If there is any destruction prior to our union with Him, that is of the mind only, and it is due to this very mind that we are confined in the mayavee creation, taking  our bodies to be our real identity and nature...and from there on, all our problems start.

Holding on to Him, through His bhakti, is the key to be freed from all this mind and maya, and also the key of our union with Him.

 

Stay blessed.

Sat Sree Akal.

Edited by harsharan000
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I think what OP is trying to ask is if we were to merge with Him, are we then God, such as can we see other people, create events, do anything

But if it wasn't then the post above this has explained it really well

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15 minutes ago, monatosingh said:

I think what OP is trying to ask is if we were to merge with Him,

are we then God, such as can we see other people, create events, do anything

 

Brother,

there, there is no I, is no  we, no they/them, no he nor she, but only Wahiguru, I repeat it once more, only HIm, Wahiguru Akal Purukh.

Sach Khand is not like Swarg, Baikunth or alike the devtay loks/planes, where gods are with goddesses, their children, devtays, demigods, evil and so on....

In Sach Khand, only Ik Oankar, Satnam exists, if anyone wants to remain or see indivduals there, then better do not follow sikhee, be a christian or a hindu or any other dharam/religion.

Sikhee is not for those who have any other desires or expectations, other than the Highest of all, only One, Wahiguru Akal Purukh.

Sat Sree Akal.

Edited by harsharan000
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Guest TheTruth

Brother no one on this forum has ever merged with waheguru so they can not tell you what they have seen nor experienced but only what they believe to be true or have heard. 

Many have experienced total bliss in meditation & apparently that is only the tip of the iceberg.

One thing is certain... a new reality awaits every follower of the truth so have faith in the word of our Guru.

 

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On 4/11/2018 at 12:04 AM, harsharan000 said:

In Sach Khand, only Ik Oankar, Satnam exists, if anyone wants to remain or see indivduals there, then better do not follow sikhee, be a christian or a hindu or any other dharam/religion.

what????

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Guest Sikhism

To enter Sach Khand you'll have to actually let go off all desires. I was thinking about this, but what's better, an endless cycle of rebirth, every time a different body, as a different person, with your whole memory wiped. The painful journey to the court of justice as a manmukh and all sorts.

 

My recommendations, start meditating on vaheguru. Try to Jaap naam whenever you can, and start reading a few pages of the Guru Granth Sahib Ji (English translated) every day and learning our religion that way. Once you start reading more and more of the Guru Granth Sahib Ji, the clearer things get. 

 

Sach Khand is indescribable, there is no paper, no words I can say to describe what it is, even if I had seen it myself I wouldn't be able to do so (Guru Granth Sahib Ji says this )

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Guest Sikhism
On 4/11/2018 at 12:04 AM, harsharan000 said:

Brother,

there, there is no I, is no  we, no they/them, no he nor she, but only Wahiguru, I repeat it once more, only HIm, Wahiguru Akal Purukh.

Sach Khand is not like Swarg, Baikunth or alike the devtay loks/planes, where gods are with goddesses, their children, devtays, demigods, evil and so on....

In Sach Khand, only Ik Oankar, Satnam exists, if anyone wants to remain or see indivduals there, then better do not follow sikhee, be a christian or a hindu or any other dharam/religion.

Sikhee is not for those who have any other desires or expectations, other than the Highest of all, only One, Wahiguru Akal Purukh.

Sat Sree Akal.

You're lost in ego. It's a sight to behold. You're preaching like Sikhism is only for the elite few who are complete and utter monks. Someone here is asking about a general query and your response is they're not Sikh enough and should stop following the path of the Guru.

The whole point of Naam Jaap is to become of that state of mind, to let go of desire, to let go of the thieves. You're asking a person to be GurSikh out of the bat. 

 Please keep on the path of the Guru, and try realise you're no better than anyone else. You may feel like you're closer than others to the Guru but it's all his will. You're creating bad karma by telling an individual who is asking more about Sikhism to stray away completely. 

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10 hours ago, Guest Sikhism said:

You're lost in ego. It's a sight to behold. You're preaching like Sikhism is only for the elite few who are complete and utter monks. Someone here is asking about a general query and your response is they're not Sikh enough and should stop following the path of the Guru.

The whole point of Naam Jaap is to become of that state of mind, to let go of desire, to let go of the thieves. You're asking a person to be GurSikh out of the bat. 

 Please keep on the path of the Guru, and try realise you're no better than anyone else. You may feel like you're closer than others to the Guru but it's all his will. You're creating bad karma by telling an individual who is asking more about Sikhism to stray away completely. 

To be fair, the question was what is it like when one merges with Vaheguru. Which Harsharan000 veer ji answered to the best of his ability. 

The quote you grabbed was actually to Monatosingh veer ji who was re-asking if one still travelled, created etc once achieving Sanyog. 

I didn't get the feeling Harsharan000 was driving anyone from Sikhi. I more got the feeling he was saying if you want to be an ego body, just an astral or causal one then Sanyog isn't what you're after. Maybe he's right, maybe not. 

We're all lost in ego. I didn't feel he was being particularly egotistical or trying to drive anyone out of Sikhi though. 

Nobody here can speak from the Place though. That I agree with. 

I like all the posts. I'd tag yours if I could, but guest posts can't get likes or thanks. You should join. You clearly have a lot to offer. 

What do you guys think of this?  Guru Nanak Ji attained Sanyog? Guru Nanak Ji lived out his life? Guru Nanak Ji reincarnated as the subsequent 9 Gurus?

I think you and Harsharan000 are both right. It has to do with total reunion with Vaheguru Ji, by Naam and elimination of ego and desire and we have no idea exactly what that's like.  

Edit: Well I combined the sentiments of two guests by mistake, but the above love for your posts and invite to join extend equally to both. 

Edited by GurjantGnostic
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On 4/10/2018 at 11:18 AM, GurpreetSingh13 said:

When you merge with Waheguru. Do you still have your own mind and soul and can see and travel... or are you Waheguru (along with many others)?????

Based on my understanding

1. Mind becomes jot saroop(IkOngkar-One non dual pure aware being) as Guru maharaj says- Man tu jot saroop hai apna mool painchain, absolute truth is perceived and expressed clearly via pure cognition driven by divine will than ego personal will.

2. Jot saroop is awaken universal unified pure awareness/consciousness - there is no individuality there nor there is separate mind, mind becomes unman(reference in gurbani) or mind becomes sanatan (ancient) see reference in gurbani.

3. Jot saroop can perceive and travel to various states of existence but not confined by them.

4. After merging, i am assuming you are talking about bhramgyan, after bhramgyan you realize the backdrop substratum truth (which is primal truth present all along - aad such jugad sach hai bhi sach nanak hosi bhi sach) you are that there is no separate somebody, other, there is only all pervading Vahiguru -one(Ekangkar/IkONGKAR) one without second.

Eko Eek Ek Har Aap

Poran Poor Rahio Prabh Baiap ||

 

5ad487f57528a_ekojap.thumb.jpeg.9d78415bad8660683cf14d585f550823.jpeg

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source: https://www.searchgurbani.com/dasam-granth/shabad/8032/line/21

 

From Sri Dasam Guru Granth:

ਜਿਮੀ ਜਮਾਨ ਕੇ ਬਿਖੈ ਸਮਸਤ ਏਕ ਜੋਤਿ ਹੈ

Jimee Jamaan Ke Bikhi Samasata Eeka Joti Hai ॥

Within all the earth and sky, there is only one Light.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੬/੧ - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਘਾਟ ਹੈ ਨ ਬਾਢ ਹੈ ਨ ਘਾਟ ਬਾਢ ਹੋਤ ਹੈ ॥

Na Ghaatta Hai Na Baadha Hai Na Ghaatta Baadha Hota Hai ॥

Which neither decreases nor increases in any being, It never decreases or increases.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੬/੨ - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਹਾਨ ਹੈ ਨ ਬਾਨ ਹੈ ਸਮਾਨ ਰੂਪ ਜਾਨੀਐ ॥

Na Haan Hai Na Baan Hai Samaan Roop Jaaneeaai ॥

It is without decadence and without habit, it is known to have the same form.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੬/੩ - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਮਕੀਨ ਅਉ ਮਕਾਨਿ ਅਪ੍ਰਮਾਨ ਤੇਜ ਮਾਨੀਐ ॥੬॥੧੬੬॥

Makeena Aau Makaani Aparmaan Teja Maaneeaai ॥6॥166॥

In all houses and places its unlimited brilliance is acknowledged. 6.166.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੬/(੪) - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਦੇਹ ਹੈ ਨ ਗੇਹ ਹੈ ਨ ਜਾਤਿ ਹੈ ਨ ਪਾਤਿ ਹੈ ॥

Na Deha Hai Na Geha Hai Na Jaati Hai Na Paati Hai ॥

He hath no body, no home, no caste and no lineage.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੭/੧ - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਮੰਤ੍ਰਿ ਹੈ ਨ ਮਿਤ੍ਰ ਹੈ ਨ ਤਾਤ ਹੈ ਨ ਮਾਤ ਹੈ ॥

Na Maantri Hai Na Mitar Hai Na Taata Hai Na Maata Hai ॥

He hath no minister, no friend, no father and no mother.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੭/੨ - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਅੰਗ ਹੈ ਨ ਰੰਗ ਹੈ ਨ ਸੰਗ ਹੈ ਨ ਸਾਥ ਹੈ ॥

Na Aanga Hai Na Raanga Hai Na Saanga Hai Na Saatha Hai ॥

He hath no limb, no colour, and hath no affection for a companion.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੭/੩ - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਦੋਖ ਹੈ ਨ ਦਾਗ ਹੈ ਨ ਦ੍ਵੈਖ ਹੈ ਨ ਦੇਹ ਹੈ ॥੭॥੧੬੭॥

Na Dokh Hai Na Daaga Hai Na Davaikh Hai Na Deha Hai ॥7॥167॥

He hath no blemish, no stain, no malice and no body.7.167.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੭/(੪) - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਹੈ ਨ ਸ੍ਯਾਰ ਹੈ ਨ ਰਾਉ ਹੈ ਨ ਰੰਕ ਹੈ ॥

Na Siaangha Hai Na Saiaara Hai Na Raau Hai Na Raanka Hai ॥

He is neither a lion, nor a jackal, nor a king nor a poor.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੮/੧ - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਮਾਨ ਹੈ ਨ ਮੌਤ ਹੈ ਨ ਸਾਕ ਹੈ ਨ ਸੰਕ ਹੈ ॥

Na Maan Hai Na Mouta Hai Na Saaka Hai Na Saanka Hai ॥

He egoless, deathless, kinless and doubtless.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੮/੨ - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਜਛ ਹੈ ਨ ਗੰਧ੍ਰਬ ਹੈ ਨ ਨਰੁ ਹੈ ਨ ਨਾਰਿ ਹੈ ॥

Na Jachha Hai Na Gaandharba Hai Na Naru Hai Na Naari Hai ॥

He is neither a Yaksha, nor a Gandharva, nor a man nor a woman.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੮/੩ - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਚੋਰ ਹੈ ਨ ਸਾਹ ਹੈ ਨ ਸਾਹ ਕੋ ਕੁਮਾਰ ਹੈ ॥੮॥੧੬੮॥

Na Chora Hai Na Saaha Hai Na Saaha Ko Kumaara Hai ॥8॥168॥

He is neither a thief, nor a moneylender nor a prince.8.168.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੮/(੪) - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਨੇਹ ਹੈ ਨ ਗੇਹ ਹੈ ਨ ਦੇਹ ਕੋ ਬਨਾਉ ਹੈ ॥

Na Neha Hai Na Geha Hai Na Deha Ko Banaau Hai ॥

He is without attachment, without home and without the formation of the body.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੯/੧ - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਛਲ ਹੈ ਨ ਛਿਦ੍ਰ ਹੈ ਨ ਛਲ ਕੋ ਮਿਲਾਉ ਹੈ ॥

Na Chhala Hai Na Chhidar Hai Na Chhala Ko Milaau Hai ॥

He is without deceit, without blemish and without the blend of deceit.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੯/੨ - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਤੰਤ੍ਰ ਹੈ ਨ ਮੰਤ੍ਰ ਹੈ ਨ ਜੰਤ੍ਰ ਕੋ ਸਰੂਪ ਹੈ ॥

Na Taantar Hai Na Maantar Hai Na Jaantar Ko Saroop Hai ॥

He is neither Tantra , nor a mantra nor the form of Yantra.

ਅਕਾਲ ਉਸਤਤਿ - ੧੬੯/੩ - ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ


ਨ ਰਾਗ ਹੈ ਨ ਰੰਗ ਹੈ ਨ ਰੇਖ ਹੈ ਨ ਰੂਪ ਹੈ ॥੯॥੧੬੯॥

Na Raaga Hai Na Raanga Hai Na Rekh Hai Na Roop Hai ॥9॥169॥

He is without affection, without colour, without form and without lineage. 9.169.

Edited by N30S1NGH
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      'One who is not welcome by her in-laws, and who has not place at her parents' house; and whose spouse does not care an iota for her, is she truly a happily married wife?'
      -Salok 31, ASGGS, Ang. 1379. 

      The 'parents' house' symbolizes societal life, the 'in-laws' spiritual life and the 'spouse' the Lord. Bhagat Farid is commenting on those spiritualists, those devotees, who desire the best of both spiritualism and societal living. He feels that by pursuing both concepts, one ultimately fails in all that he/she commits to. Guru Nanak Dev Ji comments:

      'At her in-laws and at her parents' house, she belongs to her spouse, the Divine beloved who is inaccessible and unfathomable. Oh Nanak! That one is indeed a happily married bride, who pleases the indifferent one.'
      -Mohalla 1, Salok 32, ASGGS, Ang. 1379.

      In contrast to Farid, the Guru elaborates that via Divine Grace both the temporal and spiritual paradigms become successful for the devotees. The true spiritualist is one who pursues both fields rather than renouncing one over the other. Nonetheless, hypocrisy in both fields should be avoided."   "In Suhi Lalit, Bhagat Farid forewarns:

      'You could not construct a raft when required. Now that the ocean is full and overflowing, it is hard to traverse. Do not touch the saffron flower for it's color will depart, my beloved. Rahau.
      The bride is weak and her husband's command is too hard to bear. As the milk does not return to her breast, nor will the soul return to the body. Sayeth Farid, friends, when the spouse calls this soul departeth crestfallen and the body is reduced to ashes.'
      -Suhi Lalit 1, ASGGS, Ang. 794.

      Guru Nanak Dev Ji, prior to Farid's verse, expounds:

      'Make meditation and restraint the raft via which to traverse the flowing stream. Your pass will be comfortable as if there is no ocean or overflowing stream. Your name alone is the unfading matter with which this cloak is dyed; my Beloved Lord, this color is perennial. My dear companions have departed, how will they meet the Lord? If they are united in virtue, the Lord will unite them with himself. Once united the mortal does not separate if the union be true. The cycle of birth and death is nullified by the True, Eternal Lord. She who removes her own self-centrism sews herself a garment to please her spouse. By the Guru's words, she obtained the fruit of the nectar of the Lord's word. Sayeth Nanak, my companions, my spouse be dear to me. We be the Lord's handmaidens; he our husband.'
      -Mohalla 1, Suhi 4, Ang. 729.

      Bhagat Farid provides a picture of doom and gloom by lamenting lost opportunities. He focuses on old age, where mental and physical faculties are too frail to be attuned to Divine contemplation. Guru Nanak Dev Ji, instead, expounds that it is never too late to focus on the Lord (one should remember Guru Amardass Ji here) for the Beloved is not harsh nor his commands. Via the saffron flower, Bhagat Farid warns of the fleeting pleasures of the world -here today, gone tomorrow- Guru Nanak Dev Ji instead elaborates that all pleasures belong to the Lord and via merging with him, all pleasures become permanent for he is the highest pleasure of all. 

      For Farid, death is the final test; even the faithful, in his view, should fear it for the soul never returns to the body. Guru Nanak Dev Ji however believes death to be a joy and a privilege of the valorous, for it is via death that one perfects his/her union with the Divine.

      From a Nanakian perspective, Farids's words apply to the manmukh and not the Gurmukh. But even a manmukh is worthy of Divine Grace, provided he recants at the ultimate moment."   "Bhagat Farid, a Sufi, informs us:

      'My physical frame is oven-hot; my bones are the firewood. If my feet fail, I shall walk upon my head to meet my Beloved.'
      -Salok 119, ASGGS, Ang. 1384.

      Bhagat Farid utilizes the metaphor of a kiln to depict his love for the Lord. A Sufi, his ascetic concepts however were not in line with Gurmat. Guru Nanak Dev Ji refutes his call for such asceticism by commenting:

      'Do not heat your physical frame oven-hot; burn not your bones like firewood. What harm have they committed that you torture them such? Rather behold the Beloved within your soul, Farid.'
      -Salok 120, ASGGS, Ang. 1384.

      Bhagat Farid is of the mind that the human body is but a prison and the soul it's captive. The Sikh Gurus believe that the human body is a temple, a locus where the Lord resides and awaits his devotee. By utilizing this Shabad of Farid, the Gurus desired that their Sikhs imbue the same zeal as the Sufi did whilst also discarding his asceticism; hence the refutation. Throughout Bhagat Bani we find a similar concept at play. The Sikh Gurus initiate a written dialogue with the radicals of their time and provide an unalloyed picture of the Divine Truth. For Farid, creation is a falsity; for the Gurus it is a truth. Farid's asceticism renders the body as simply an object; the Gurus however perceive it to be divine and encourage their Sikhs to employ it in the service of the Divine by societal living." I printed all this out in pamphlet form and took it to a local Nagar Kirtan when I was in Australia and man, some of the Muslims burned. A few confrontations occurred, "how can you say Guru Nanak was a non-Muslim?!" "Gobind Singh made you anti-Muslim." "Your history is a lie, all Gurus were Muslims and they even married Muslims!" Basically they were clutching at straws. The pamphlets were enough to make the Sikhs ignore these idiots and they grew worried and left the scene. Later a famous attendant Gyani, from Taksal (and who I will not name), got hold of one of the pamphlets. After having it explained to him he called me over and asked me what jatha I belonged to. I told him none. Then he asked me where I got this information from. I told him my sources. Basically his problem was that I was not crediting any jatha on my pamphlet. He asked me to mention Taksal in them but I refused. Few days later all the pamphlets were thrown in the trash and I was told to abstain from publishing such (and here's how they described them) lies. The youth wanted more, but the Gurughar committee would have none of it. The main problem, here, is the liberal fuddu attitude our qaum has that respect all faiths at the expense of your own.  After this some of us decided to stick to the social media. There was veer Bijla Singh Ji with his Search Sikhism page which, back in the heyday of grooming, forced several Muslim preachers to quit their anti-Sikh proselytizing. There were a few more who set up Tisarpanth. Then there was The Truth of Sikhi and Shamshir Publications. Bijla Singh Ji advised us but out of the three initiatives set up, only one is going strong and the others were forced to close down. Why? Because they had to hit the streets and they faced the same problem which I did- our own elders were and still are shooting us down. If we had claimed affiliation with some jatha, then we would have been lionized.   
    • In that way you're right. It is a big deal. My heart would pain to see anyone lost to Islam especially on a large scale. And your cautionary message is well founded.  But in the fake news, shame Sikhi, propaganda way I feel it was being used. Pfft. In that context I feel more a response of "And? Big deal. Who gives a ****"
    • That's her father in law Tarsem Singh of Hushiarpur, he is the village Granthi.   Her father's name is Monohar Lal of Delhi and her name is Kiran Bala. Sikhs don't have names like Lal and Bala. These are typical Hindu names.
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