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Why can't women do seva in Harminder Sahib?


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Find or have a bibi jatha ready who will do the kirtan not one time but regularly. Last time I was in talks with them, their only complaint was there is no “regular” jatha that can come to do regular duty. There is no rule barring women to do any sewa but a reform is needed only if someone who will do sewa regularly. All sewadars are there locally.

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5 minutes ago, MrDoaba said:

correction veer ji a bibi can ONLY do parkarma sewa if accompanied by a male relative and only if she wears the uniform of SGPC . This is their rules .

Bhaenji, there is no such rule. Bibian does lot of sewa every part of the day. They start doing sewa starting at 2am. Parkarma washing starts before sunrise and many locals and non-locals participate in this sewa. None of the SGPC employees do these sewa. They only watch.

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17 minutes ago, MrDoaba said:

the washing of internal surfaces of the actual darbar room is NOT permitted if you are a female ...again their rules reason given was safaiee if cycle is occurring ...yeah I have been told this

I was once stopped to do inside sewa as it is very limited to few dedicated folks or if you know someone. The initial sewa of inside darbar sahib sewa is usually done by male members. The reason they don’t want singhni to be in there is because pajamia are not allowed while doing that sewa. Sewadars become very wet while doing sewa and dress wise only chola and kachera allowed. Time is also very tight. Also only amritdharis are allowed to do the washing sewa. Do note that bibian are sitting with the sangat (small group) of mostly 99% bibian sitting outside of Darshan deori reciting paath for hundreds of years before quar opens up for the day.

Maybe days of inside sewa should be given as “women only” or men only. I would prefer to let it stay the way it is. 

Reform is needed then they (SGPC) should allow dumalla wearing keertania to be allowed. If you are brown man and wants to do kirtan, you won’t be allowed to do in dumalla. I found this crazy rule. 

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Women can’t do seva for the same reason non of the 10 Guru’s were women, non of the 5 pyare were women, 15 Bhagats who have Bani in SGGS non of them are women, there’s no historical evidence that any woman was given khande batte Di pahul in 1699.... budhal dal & Hazoor Sahib still don’t! 

A number of our Gurus were given Gurgaddi at very young age.... meaning gurgaddi could be passed on to a male ‘child’ but still never a woman.

all you ‘equal rights’ banders, if you don’t like the Sikhi our Guru established please go somewhere else... stop trying to change Guru Sahibs Sikhi 

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8 hours ago, S1ngh said:

I was once stopped to do inside sewa as it is very limited to few dedicated folks or if you know someone. The initial sewa of inside darbar sahib sewa is usually done by male members. The reason they don’t want singhni to be in there is because pajamia are not allowed while doing that sewa. Sewadars become very wet while doing sewa and dress wise only chola and kachera allowed. Time is also very tight. Also only amritdharis are allowed to do the washing sewa. Do note that bibian are sitting with the sangat (small group) of mostly 99% bibian sitting outside of Darshan deori reciting paath for hundreds of years before quar opens up for the day.

Maybe days of inside sewa should be given as “women only” or men only. I would prefer to let it stay the way it is. 

Reform is needed then they (SGPC) should allow dumalla wearing keertania to be allowed. If you are brown man and wants to do kirtan, you won’t be allowed to do in dumalla. I found this crazy rule. 

Spot on, you have to know someone, usually senior. My brother and I were lucky enough to be Giani Gurdev Singh (UK) when we got the chance to wash the inner sanctum, and it's an amazing experience. 

3HO had a lot of clout with Badals, Yogi was obviously using his wealth to buy favours so unsurprising to see them given a free pass.

 

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8 hours ago, S1ngh said:

I was once stopped to do inside sewa as it is very limited to few dedicated folks or if you know someone. The initial sewa of inside darbar sahib sewa is usually done by male members. The reason they don’t want singhni to be in there is because pajamia are not allowed while doing that sewa. Sewadars become very wet while doing sewa and dress wise only chola and kachera allowed. Time is also very tight. Also only amritdharis are allowed to do the washing sewa. Do note that bibian are sitting with the sangat (small group) of mostly 99% bibian sitting outside of Darshan deori reciting paath for hundreds of years before quar opens up for the day.

Maybe days of inside sewa should be given as “women only” or men only. I would prefer to let it stay the way it is. 

Reform is needed then they (SGPC) should allow dumalla wearing keertania to be allowed. If you are brown man and wants to do kirtan, you won’t be allowed to do in dumalla. I found this crazy rule. 

lot of the attitude is brahmanical e.g. male relative needed (I had pointed out if bibi is widow of 84 then she may be barred according to that rule also mata kaulan ji in modern days would be rejected if she turned up on chaa of doing sewa) and women doing the 'very physical' cleaning of parkarma etc would entice men's wrong thinking . To which I replied that Men need to respect the darbar asul and not be entertaining kaami thoughts . I remember going when I was nine and there were massive numbers of ordinary bibian cleaning parkarma unhindered or un-uniformed  no pervert tendencies appeared in the men then so what is the BS excuse now.
 

Surely if bibian are wearing proper length kacchere and long length choley then that will not be an issue of temptation as many bibian pull up their salwars to the knee to do water work elsewhere. The fact that I have seen non amritdhari giving khannda to palki sahib (filmed ) I think this is all about who you know, not an open hearted show of Khalsa family together.

I agree white kirtania do not run foul of rule of no dumalla somehow , yet apne do ...it's all manmat . Yes perhaps it would be good to have alternate days of sewa but the whole antifemale attitude has come into the running of our gurdwarey ...

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9 hours ago, S1ngh said:

Bhaenji, there is no such rule. Bibian does lot of sewa every part of the day. They start doing sewa starting at 2am. Parkarma washing starts before sunrise and many locals and non-locals participate in this sewa. None of the SGPC employees do these sewa. They only watch.

I read the rule book that they produced when the protest happened , I know it's manmat that's why I think all sikhs should oppose it .

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3 hours ago, Singh123456777 said:

Sgpc is messed, they didnt let the descendants of bhai mardana ji to do kirtan at darbar sahib.

I have no sympathy for sgpcand hope they burn

SGPC setup is good but it is corrupted down to the core. It needs to be finished off and then restart it again. Sant bhinderanwale’s major internal fight was against these SGPC folks. It was SGPC main person who ordered the hit on sant jees right hand man ‘bhai sodhi’. To maintain unity sant jees never made the fight public until the very end. There is audio of sant jee an hour long where he opened everything on SGPC and Badal.

Bhai Mardana jee descendants has the greatest respect ever from Sikhs. But do remember that maryada always need to be followed. No person who are non-amritdhari can do kirtan inside darbar sahib.

jk bhaenji, again there are no restriction of anyone Cleaning parkarma. Dozens of ladies do that everyday. Male relative is never needed for any sewa that bibian does in darbar sahib. The inside sewa is bit tricky subject. Again there are no rules barring specific gender but it’s just not the norm and that can be easily changed if the locals agree with it; and by saying locals mean Sikh ladies who are going to darbar sahib every single day for ages. If they want to start this sewa, it can be easily done overnight as they have more power to say than one-time tourist.

I have seen the sewa part when I was young because my mom used to go to darbar sahib everyday 2am for more than 30 years. 

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20 minutes ago, S1ngh said:

Bhai Mardana jee descendants has the greatest respect ever from Sikhs. But do remember that maryada always need to be followed. No person who are non-amritdhari can do kirtan inside darbar sahib.

This maryada was only started around the time of sgpc. Before that non amritdharis used to do kirtan as well.

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