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Bhaai Jugraj Singh says "Guru is God"?

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4 hours ago, Guest Guest said:

if the gurus were Gods - why did they die ? And why did God need to come in 10 forms rather then just one.

when guru  Nanak disappeared and was one with God, does that mean he was at one with himself ? That's doesn't make sense 

when guru angad was being tested by guru Nanak - was God test himself ? Also guru angad converted from Hinduism ? That doesn't make sense either if he was God

2 gurus were exicuted - how can that be if they were God ? How can God die - at least the Christian narrative about Jesus makes some sort of sense this makes none. The 7fh guru was a 5 year old child that died at age 9 from smallpox. How do you explain that if he was God?

if the gurus were gods of avataars of God then are their children demigods ?

how does this work with the mool mantra ? 

Why did God come in 10 forms. Each Guru played a different role and yet the same. They completely changed a system, a culture. Turned it all on its head. To change a people's culture takes time. Rome wasn't built over night? From Guru Nanak Sahib ji to Guru Gobind Singh ji. It all lead to the Khalsa Panth. A slow and steady process. An evolution. A gradual development. At the time of Guru Nanak Sahib ji the sikhs were not ready to pick up arms. They were far from being able to rule themselves. Fast forward to Guru Gobind Singh ji, we become a sovereign people. That takes time. To change a mindset, break a centuries old culture takes time.

The rest of your questions were answered perfectly by Kira. 

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13 minutes ago, S4NGH said:

if the gurus were Gods - why did they die ?

I think it is offensive to say the Gurus died. They did not die. People die. We say joti jot samaa gae with great respect for the Gurus for their spirits went to meet with the spirit of God. 

Janam maran dhoho mae nahi ... jan par upkari aaye.

The Gurus are above birth and death. They did not have themselves in mind when they came on earth. God our faether sent them to us - just like if you want to get across to a baby you say goo goo gaa gaa and smile and wave your hand and hold their hands. We are in the flesh and blood and we can only understand a language given to us by someone in flesh and blood. The Gurus and God are above this. They are in a spirit form. We while on earth are separated from our souls. We are lost in maya and cannot understand many things. 

Tu samrath vadh meri mat thori Raam. We simply do not have the understanding to understand fully what God really is. 

Why did they take birth on earth? They all came as messengers from God to deliver to us the message. 

One thing is though, they did not speak in parables like Jesus did. After reading the Guru Granth Sahib, you will get a better understanding of the Bible. Jesus was not able to deliver the message as clearly as Guru Nanak Dev Ji.

Perhaps humanity was simply not that evolved at that time to be able to interpret the message and understand it. 

 

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10 minutes ago, sikhni777 said:

I think it is offensive to say the Gurus died. They did not die. People die. We say joti jot samaa gae with great respect for the Gurus for their spirits went to meet with the spirit of God. 

Janam maran dhoho mae nahi ... jan par upkari aaye.

The Gurus are above birth and death. They did not have themselves in mind when they came on earth. God our faether sent them to us - just like if you want to get across to a baby you say goo goo gaa gaa and smile and wave your hand and hold their hands. We are in the flesh and blood and we can only understand a language given to us by someone in flesh and blood. The Gurus and God are above this. They are in a spirit form. We while on earth are separated from our souls. We are lost in maya and cannot understand many things. 

Tu samrath vadh meri mat thori Raam. We simply do not have the understanding to understand fully what God really is. 

Why did they take birth on earth? They all came as messengers from God to deliver to us the message. 

One thing is though, they did not speak in parables like Jesus did. After reading the Guru Granth Sahib, you will get a better understanding of the Bible. Jesus was not able to deliver the message as clearly as Guru Nanak Dev Ji.

Perhaps humanity was simply not that evolved at that time to be able to interpret the message and understand it. 

 

I agree with you. I also didn't say that ji :) I was quoting "Guest Guest". 

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9 hours ago, sikhni777 said:

It certainly seems a Christian belief as they believe only In God. They believe Jesus to be his son, not his spirit or jot. However we believe all the Gurus had his jot. Not only that, but also Ram, Krishna etc were a roop of God, however In different yugs.

The whites have generally been more of a pagan worshipping people whereas India has generally had a long history of rishis and munis performing bhagti from quite a long while back. 

Might want to brush up on the Christian Trinity. Christians do indeed believe jesus was/is God. The father, son and holy spirit all in one is God according to Christian belief. However... This is a clear contradiction to earlier Christian writings and the old testament... But that's a story for another day :)

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Guest Daas

The Guru and God are one. There is no difference between them but God is still everywhere. You can think of it as we're all drops in the ocean of God but the Guru understands this and is fully connected with this truth whilst we have forgotten it. We can't see ourselves as a part of God and we don't know who we are. The Gurus were like God, without ego, whereas we have ego. That's what Bhai Jagraj talked about. The Gurus were perfect beings, they were sent by Maharaj to guide us onto the oath of truth. 

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7 hours ago, S4NGH said:

I agree with you. I also didn't say that ji :) I was quoting "Guest Guest". 

Sorry about that. I did quote guestguest from your quote,  however the system decided that If you quote a quote then the quote starts to belong to you!

Sorry once again.

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1 minute ago, sikhni777 said:

Sorry about that. I did quote guestguest from your quote,  however the system decided that If you quote a quote then the quote starts to belong to you!

Sorry once again.

It happens penji. No need to apologise.

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Guest Reply

 

@Kira your answers are really dumb.

bhai lena was a Hindu guru angad was not ... what stupid logic - he was the same person regardless of name change 

gurus allowed themselves 2 to be killed - lol - so they commited suicide ?

guru harikrishan finished his mission. And what was that exactly? If he was God then obviously he hasn't as there were 2 more gurus after him. Might I add the kalsa was formed after him. Huru harkrishan didn't leave any  sayings or works ... what kind of God allows himself to die from a desease humans can cure?

And you didn't answer my question about their children - are they demigods? How can God have sex with mortals? 

Why did guru gobind Singh need binding from Mughal army if he was God ? Guru gobind also never entered Amritsar because of rival gurus? How can that be if he was God? 

I can go on all day - none of this makes sense - gurus were human beings ... anyone with half a brain  can see - keep imur Hindu beliefs to your self ...

 

 

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Guest MandeepKaur

But is there a passage in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj or in the Dasam Bani where Guru Nanak or any of the other Gurus say "I am God or worship me"?

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1 hour ago, Guest Reply said:

 

@Kira your answers are really dumb.

bhai lena was a Hindu guru angad was not ... what stupid logic - he was the same person regardless of name change 

 

Guru Nanak Dev Ji said he wasn't Bhai Lehna anymore But Guru Angad Dev Ji, he was merely another form of Guru Nanak Dev Ji. Are you going to call him a liar? Gurbani also testifies to this.

Quote

gurus allowed themselves 2 to be killed - lol - so they commited suicide ?

Pretty sure it was a willing sacrifice for the greater good.

Quote

guru harikrishan finished his mission. And what was that exactly? If he was God then obviously he hasn't as there were 2 more gurus after him. Might I add the kalsa was formed after him. Huru harkrishan didn't leave any  sayings or works ... what kind of God allows himself to die from a desease humans can cure?

His mission was to demonstrate that Brahmgyan can come in any form and at any age. Guru Harkrishan Ji also cured thousands of people with smallpox, how stupid for you as a sikh to say they contracted it and had no power to stop it when he was actively purging it from everyone around him.

Quote

And you didn't answer my question about their children - are they demigods? How can God have sex with mortals? 

The Guru Sahib's wives were incarnations of Adi-Shakti, I'll explain this concept to you since you'll have a heart attack and call it Brahmvaad. 

Adi-Shakti is the primal energy of Akaal Purkh, his power.  The Sahibzaade were probably bhagats in previous lives.

Quote

Why did guru gobind Singh need binding from Mughal army if he was God ? Guru gobind also never entered Amritsar because of rival gurus? How can that be if he was God? 

He never followed anything the mughals said? have you ever read Batiichtar Natek? Guru Sahib did as he pleased and that annoyed the mughals. 

Are you really this dense? Guru Sahib didn't visit one place and suddenly its all hell breaks loose. In-case you missed the memo he was arming sikhs, he had other things to contend to. Guru Sahib never even attempted to enter Harmandhir Sahib.

Quote

I can go on all day - none of this makes sense - gurus were human beings ... anyone with half a brain  can see - keep imur Hindu beliefs to your self ...

g1386197969847308927.jpg

So let's all reject all the old texts that atest to this. Let's reject all the Gurbani that even goes out and says "Gur Parmeshar eko jan" and countless other verses all stating that Satguru Ji was Akaal Purkh's avataar, all because some neo-liberal hippy who's never read into Gurbani says so.

You can call me Hindu all you want. But you're the one peddling that God is separate from creation. So very christian.

Come back to the table when you can actually understand the concepts of Sargun and Nirgun. Which are integral to Sikh philosophy.

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45 minutes ago, Kira said:

Guru Nanak Dev Ji said he wasn't Bhai Lehna anymore But Guru Angad Dev Ji, he was merely another form of Guru Nanak Dev Ji. Are you going to call him a liar? Gurbani also testifies to this.

Pretty sure it was a willing sacrifice for the greater good.

His mission was to demonstrate that Brahmgyan can come in any form and at any age. Guru Harkrishan Ji also cured thousands of people with smallpox, how stupid for you as a sikh to say they contracted it and had no power to stop it when he was actively purging it from everyone around him.

The Guru Sahib's wives were incarnations of Adi-Shakti, I'll explain this concept to you since you'll have a heart attack and call it Brahmvaad. 

Adi-Shakti is the primal energy of Akaal Purkh, his power.  The Sahibzaade were probably bhagats in previous lives.

He never followed anything the mughals said? have you ever read Batiichtar Natek? Guru Sahib did as he pleased and that annoyed the mughals. 

Are you really this dense? Guru Sahib didn't visit one place and suddenly its all hell breaks loose. In-case you missed the memo he was arming sikhs, he had other things to contend to. Guru Sahib never even attempted to enter Harmandhir Sahib.

g1386197969847308927.jpg

So let's all reject all the old texts that atest to this. Let's reject all the Gurbani that even goes out and says "Gur Parmeshar eko jan" and countless other verses all stating that Satguru Ji was Akaal Purkh's avataar, all because some neo-liberal hippy who's never read into Gurbani says so.

You can call me Hindu all you want. But you're the one peddling that God is separate from creation. So very christian.

Come back to the table when you can actually understand the concepts of Sargun and Nirgun. Which are integral to Sikh philosophy.

bro even Rig Veda told Brahmins that Kalyug and Eternal Avtar Guru will be named Nanak that after him will be ten Gurus the last being Munn = Silent ...if your own faith's writings don't put anything faith in you another's highest writings tell you he is the one full Avtar

 

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Guest Truth
On 10/11/2017 at 6:41 PM, Guest MandeepB said:

Dear Sangath, I recently came accross a Amrathdhari Sikh who says "Guru's are actually God's, that Guru Nanak is the Lord of the Universe". I never heard that before, so i asked him who taught you that, he says, Basics of Sikhi, Bhaai Jugraj Singh's video: 

I am confused, i thought Guru's are human beings? Please advise. Thank you

 

 

A human being can become immortal by practicing an immortal psychology. 

 

Read Gurbani and apply it to your life. 

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Guest Culture is Maya.
11 hours ago, S4NGH said:

Why did God come in 10 forms. Each Guru played a different role and yet the same. They completely changed a system, a culture. Turned it all on its head. To change a people's culture takes time. Rome wasn't built over night? From Guru Nanak Sahib ji to Guru Gobind Singh ji. It all lead to the Khalsa Panth. A slow and steady process. An evolution. A gradual development. At the time of Guru Nanak Sahib ji the sikhs were not ready to pick up arms. They were far from being able to rule themselves. Fast forward to Guru Gobind Singh ji, we become a sovereign people. That takes time. To change a mindset, break a centuries old culture takes time.

The rest of your questions were answered perfectly by Kira. 

The problem Is culture. 

 

Everyone has and is attached to a culture in Maya.

 

And its culture that leads us off the path, culture and other fools attached to and blinded by that culture that plant doubts in our mind of the divinity that lies within us and that IS us. 

 

We are One with Him-made of the same stuff. With or without Him.

 

He never leaves is, our fault is that we ignore his All Pervading presence. 

 

The aim is to stop believing culture and believing in our True Selves instead. 

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16 minutes ago, jkvlondon said:

bro even Rig Veda told Brahmins that Kalyug and Eternal Avtar Guru will be named Nanak that after him will be ten Gurus the last being Munn = Silent ...if your own faith's writings don't put anything faith in you another's highest writings tell you he is the one full Avtar

 

Do you have a reference (even better, an online link) to the specific part of Rig Ved that says this? It would be very handy.

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3 hours ago, Guest Reply said:

I can go on all day - none of this makes sense - gurus were human beings ... anyone with half a brain  can see - keep imur Hindu beliefs to your self ...

Please do go on, I am interested in knowing all of the arguments Muslims want to make. 

BTW, if you want to have a conversation, please get an account. It's free. All you require is an email address, which 99% you probably already have, but if not, that's free, too.

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