Amritvela with a roommate not wanting to inconvenience

[Kira]

20 minutes ago, Sukhvirk1976 said:

I agree it means disciple.. But it can mean a disciple of knowledge in its widest sense. 

I've always thought it curious that in mool mantar the shabad is gurprasad and not guru prasad ie. Through the grace of knowledge 

Through the Grace of the Guru is the correct translation not knowledge. That spelling for Guru was common back then and is used thousands of times in Gurbani.

 

[Sukhvirk1976]

5 minutes ago, Kira said:

Through the Grace of the Guru is the correct translation not knowledge. That spelling for Guru was common back then and is used thousands of times in Gurbani.

 

I'm not convinced by that.. The term guru was widely used and the Guru's were very careful one may say pedantic in articulating themselves 'shudh'. At the very least it is ambiguous covering and including both interpretations? 

[Kira]

4 minutes ago, Sukhvirk1976 said:

I'm not convinced by that.. The term guru was widely used and the Guru's were very careful one may say pedantic in articulating themselves 'shudh'. At the very least it is ambiguous covering and including both interpretations? 

ਗੁਰ ਨਾਨਕ ਸਰਣਾਗਤਿ ਤੋਰੀ ॥੪॥੨੬॥
 

ਗੁਰ ਕਾ ਸਿਖੁ ਬਿਕਾਰ ਤੇ ਹਾਟੈ ॥ 
 

These are just 2 examples. The word Guru is less frequently used, read the Granth not just the Mool mantar, and read it directly from Gurmukhi. 

[Sukhvirk1976]

26 minutes ago, Kira said:

ਗੁਰ ਨਾਨਕ ਸਰਣਾਗਤਿ ਤੋਰੀ ॥੪॥੨੬॥
 

ਗੁਰ ਕਾ ਸਿਖੁ ਬਿਕਾਰ ਤੇ ਹਾਟੈ ॥ 
 

These are just 2 examples. The word Guru is less frequently used, read the Granth not just the Mool mantar, and read it directly from Gurmukhi. 

I totally agree with you but I don't think the terms are used interchangeably rather by design? 

[simran345]

Changed my mind. 

 

[Sukhvirk1976]

Thanks for that.! I think I'm approaching the term from a deeper philosophical position which is inclusive of the interpretation given her.. I think one of the most amazing things about Gurbani is the non-dogmatic nature of it.. 

It's very interesting and I will revisit this video by Nanak naam who I think are excellent in the work they do.. I find I'm much more comfortable with there work than BoS 

[Kira]

20 minutes ago, Sukhvirk1976 said:

I totally agree with you but I don't think the terms are used interchangeably rather by design? 

The Punjabi Language is alot more different than it was in the past Gur (without the Dolenkar or an onkar) is alot more formal while with it, it speaks a-lot more intimately. The codswallop that it means knowledge is completely counter to its actual arth.

[Sukhvirk1976]

7 minutes ago, Kira said:

The Punjabi Language is alot more different than it was in the past Gur (without the Dolenkar or an onkar) is alot more formal while with it, it speaks a-lot more intimately. The codswallop that it means knowledge is completely counter to its actual arth.

I'm not sure. My own analysis has taken me away from the translation that it means just teacher/master but rather source of knowledge. I agree it is elusive but then so much in bani is.. I suppose necessarily so else it would be easy! 

[Kira]

3 minutes ago, Sukhvirk1976 said:

I'm not sure. My own analysis has taken me away from the translation that it means just teacher/master but rather source of knowledge. I agree it is elusive but then so much in bani is.. I suppose necessarily so else it would be easy! 

Your own analysis is wrong then. Nearly all Brahmgyanis, prachariks and linguistics have all translated it to be "by the Grace of the Guru" Gurbani itself has defined the word. So either you're right or Gurbani is wrong.  Gurbani is extremely straightforward in Sri Guru Granth Sahib, the language in it is beautiful but simple. Just read it in Gurmukhi. 

[Sukhvirk1976]

4 minutes ago, Kira said:

Your own analysis is wrong then. Nearly all Brahmgyanis, prachariks and linguistics have all translated it to be "by the Grace of the Guru" Gurbani itself has defined the word. So either you're right or Gurbani is wrong.  Gurbani is extremely straightforward in Sri Guru Granth Sahib, the language in it is beautiful but simple. Just read it in Gurmukhi. 

I think personal khoj is very important. It is a must for me to dig deep to research and appreciate all sources of knowledge and exegesis and discount any doubts.. I believe guru ji demands this of me.. 

If you have accepted that interpretation then good for you. You may well be right but I'll need to arrive at that position myself. Even if everyone in the world told me that I was wrong until my own intellect resolved it I would be a coward and a sheep to just agree unless I truly believed it