Jonny101

Dhunda VS Dandrianwala

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Ever since Dhandrianwala became a missionary, he has now become the favourite of missionaries worldwide. He is like their new hero. Before, it was Dhunda who was the undisputed champion of missionaries. But Dhandrianwala has now claimed this position. For Dhunda this means he is now in less demand as he was before. He has probably felt that as well, especially when it is your only source of livelihood and income. But Dhunda is having no more. He has lashed back. Just look at how he is speaking of Dhandrianwala.

 

 

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He is even indirectly said that the reason why Dhandrianwala is not marrying is because he might have "sreer di problem", meaning he is unable to physically have relationship with a woman due to physical deficiency. Of course this might not be the real reason but it is quite interesting to see how heretics turn on each other. They have no principles  

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Dhunda's the same guy who raised doubt and objection on existence of Hemkunt sahib as well . 

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54 minutes ago, Jonny101 said:

While on the subject of the heretics. A missionary recently went to Takht Sri Hazur Sahib. When the Sikhs according to their tradition were doing aarti with the thaali. The missionary did Beadbi by trying to knock out the Thaali and disrupt the Aarti. The Sikhs in Hazur Sahib are not like the Sikhs in Punjab who tolerate the Beadbis done by missionaries. The Sikhs of Hazur Sahib gave the missionary heretic a severe beating he will never forget.

 

 

19875524_10213075740830056_5165429082909619962_n.jpg

What evidence you have the singh in pic above was beaten at hazur sahib and for the reason you said ?

Secondly, just because he objected to hazur sahib aarti maryada doesn't mean he's anti-sikh or anti-panth . Neither does it mean he wanted to do beadbi of Guru sahib. Maybe, like many SGPC people and the singh-sabha reformists (or should I say Originalists) , he might have seen the hindu-style aarti , ringing of bells and conch in hazur sahib as creeping horrors of hindutva.

I am not saying the aarti and ringing of bells and blowing of conch in hazur sahib is something original or hindu influence. TBH I have no idea on issue.  This warrants creation of another thread lol, but all I am saying is lets not demean our own singhs without understanding the reason behind their actions first. 

 

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1 hour ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

What evidence you have the singh in pic above was beaten at hazur sahib and for the reason you said ?

Secondly, just because he objected to hazur sahib aarti maryada doesn't mean he's anti-sikh or anti-panth . Neither does it mean he wanted to do beadbi of Guru sahib. Maybe, like many SGPC people and the singh-sabha reformists (or should I say Originalists) , he might have seen the hindu-style aarti , ringing of bells and conch in hazur sahib as creeping horrors of hindutva.

I am not saying the aarti and ringing of bells and blowing of conch in hazur sahib is something original or hindu influence. TBH I have no idea on issue.  This warrants creation of another thread lol, but all I am saying is lets not demean our own singhs without understanding the reason behind their actions first. 

 

He didn't just object, he tried to actually physically stop the Aarti from happening. That is Beadbi. Someone shared this with me in email. The original post can be seen here.

 

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10213075741630076&id=1289435498

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7 hours ago, Jonny101 said:

Ever since Dhandrianwala became a missionary, he has now become the favourite of missionaries worldwide. He is like their new hero. Before, it was Dhunda who was the undisputed champion of missionaries. But Dhandrianwala has now claimed this position. For Dhunda this means he is now in less demand as he was before. He has probably felt that as well, especially when it is your only source of livelihood and income. But Dhunda is having no more. He has lashed back. Just look at how he is speaking of Dhandrianwala.

Well, he spoke of deradars, but he didn't directly speak of Dhadrianwale, right?

Also, as far as Dhunda Sahib saying that it's OK not to have been married, but it's not OK to say that not being married is some sort of great religious deed: I distinctly remember that at one point Dhadrianwale quoted the line:

ਗਿਆਨਨ ਮੈ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਅਰੁ ਧਿਆਨਨ ਮੈ ਧਿਆਨ ਗੁਰ ਸਕਲ ਧਰਮ ਮੈ ਗ੍ਰਿਹਸਤੁ ਪ੍ਰਧਾਨ ਹੈ ॥੩੭੬॥

Just as the knowledge imparted by the True Guru is supreme of all knowledge, and concentration of mind on True Guru is superb, so is the family life ideal and superior of all the religions (ways of life).  (376)

ਭਾਈ ਗੁਰਦਾਸ ਜੀ : ਕਬਿੱਤ ੩੭੬ ਪੰ. ੪

But then he said, "But the writer of this line, Bhai Gurdas, himself did not marry. So it is OK not to marry." I won't go into whether Bhai Gurdas Ji married or not, but I just want to say that Dhadrianwale strongly advocated that not marrying is OK, so it's interesting that Dhunda is strongly refuting that.

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6 hours ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

Secondly, just because he objected to hazur sahib aarti maryada doesn't mean he's anti-sikh or anti-panth .

Perhaps, but it's a very bad idea to think that you're going to be a "hero" and obliterate the existing Hazur Sahib maryada. If you disagree with an aspect of the maryada, it would be better to peacefully present your opinions to sangat (in Nanded or in Punjab) or write an article.

It is interesting that Sant Gurbachan Singh Ji Bhindawale did not recommend doing aarti with lamps, but I find no evidence that he tried to create a scene at Hazur Sahib. The same for other famous Sikh contemporaries of his, like Bhai Vir Singh ji, Baba Nand Singh ji, Sant Isher Singh ji, Sants Attar Singh jis, Bhai Randhir Singh ji, Pandit Kartar Singh Dakha and so on.

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7 hours ago, Jonny101 said:

He is even indirectly said that the reason why Dhandrianwala is not marrying is because he might have "sreer di problem", meaning he is unable to physically have relationship with a woman due to physical deficiency. Of course this might not be the real reason but it is quite interesting to see how heretics turn on each other. They have no principles  

Yes, you're right about that. It was amusing to see the Spokesman turn on Ragi Darshan Singh. And also former Spokesman reporters turning on and condemning the Spokesman after the Spokesman editor (Joginder Singh Sahni) started to say Guru Granth Sahib wasn't written by Guru Nanak (he says "Baba Nanak"), and the other gurus were just usurpers. 

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7 hours ago, Jonny101 said:

Ever since Dhandrianwala became a missionary, he has now become the favourite of missionaries worldwide. He is like their new hero. Before, it was Dhunda who was the undisputed champion of missionaries. But Dhandrianwala has now claimed this position. For Dhunda this means he is now in less demand as he was before. He has probably felt that as well, especially when it is your only source of livelihood and income. But Dhunda is having no more. He has lashed back. Just look at how he is speaking of Dhandrianwala.

Did you notice the banner in the background? It seems to say "Gurdwara Singh Sabha ... Mandi Ahmedgarh".

OK, now putting "Ahmedgarh" into Google, we find that Ahmedgarh is just a kasbah (small town) with a population of 30000. The 2011 Indian Census says there are 31302 residents of Ahmedgarh, and 29.62% are Sikh, so 31302x0.2962 = 9271 Sikhs.

So preacher Dhunda is now going to places that only have 9 thousand Sikhs? That seems quite amazing to me. You could either see that as scraping the bottom of the barrel, or that he is quite active, even being invited to the smallest of population centers, which is alarming. It's not just people in Toronto and Vancouver who have gone nuts, it's people in small, supposedly conservative, towns that are giving support to him. Sikhs, wake up!

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On 15/07/2017 at 8:47 AM, Jonny101 said:

A missionary recently went to Takht Sri Hazur Sahib. When the Sikhs according to their tradition were doing aarti with the thaali. The missionary did Beadbi by trying to knock out the Thaali and disrupt the Aarti. The Sikhs in Hazur Sahib are not like the Sikhs in Punjab who tolerate the Beadbis done by missionaries. The Sikhs of Hazur Sahib gave the missionary heretic a severe beating he will never forget.

 

That is not a severe beating. it is only a few thappar/punches. No-one who had a good beating like this guy deserved would be able to sit up for his picture like that. he would have been lying on a manja like poohla was. A few weeks ago, there was the incident of some youth being hacked to death in Panjab for allegedly selling drugs(remember allegedly). There was also a case where some muslamaniacs battered some guy in Peshawar University for not being radical enough. Students in a university!!!

Yet in a Gurdwara where Sikhs are armed to the teeth, and where there are no dearth of weapons, no-one thought to really hurt this cretin. I mean really hurt him.

 

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On 15/07/2017 at 8:36 AM, Jonny101 said:

Before, it was Dhunda who was the undisputed champion of missionaries

 

On 15/07/2017 at 8:40 AM, Jonny101 said:

but it is quite interesting to see how heretics turn on each other.

 

Dhunda when there began to be opposition to his teachings in Panjab, released a video of the missionary college doing Jaap Sahib paath, which turned the diehard miss naris against him. They were dissing him left right and centre. Since Ranjit Singh came on the scene they have clamoured around him as he is hugely popular in Panjab. Ranjits singhs diwans are not about Sikh any more, but to diss Harnam Singh and the Taksal.

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On ‎15‎/‎07‎/‎2017 at 7:47 PM, Jonny101 said:

While on the subject of the heretics. A missionary recently went to Takht Sri Hazur Sahib. When the Sikhs according to their tradition were doing aarti with the thaali. The missionary did Beadbi by trying to knock out the Thaali and disrupt the Aarti. The Sikhs in Hazur Sahib are not like the Sikhs in Punjab who tolerate the Beadbis done by missionaries. The Sikhs of Hazur Sahib gave the missionary heretic a severe beating he will never forget.

 

 

19875524_10213075740830056_5165429082909619962_n.jpg

So you support  this hindu rituals like the arti they do at Hazur Sahib( totally contradictory to Guru Nanak's Arti)

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8 hours ago, JSinghnz said:

So you support  this hindu rituals like the arti they do at Hazur Sahib( totally contradictory to Guru Nanak's Arti)

Tenu ki patha sallliya. Anyone can talk on a forum please go to sachkhand hazoori sahib and tell them why they are wrong. You wouldn't because your tail would be eternal your legs, majority of posters on this forum don't have the balls to do <banned word filter activated> . Keep weapons without knowing how to use them...how ritualistic is that? 

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13 hours ago, JSinghnz said:

So you support  this hindu rituals like the arti they do at Hazur Sahib( totally contradictory to Guru Nanak's Arti)

Personally no. I don't support the thaali aarti either. But there is a way to get your views across without actually doing what the man in the picture did by physically trying to stop their tradition. That is beadvi in the eyes of Hazuri Sikhs present there.  ਜੇ ਦਲੀਲ ਨਾਲ ਗੱਲ ਹੋਵੇ ਤਾਂ ਸਾਡੀਆਂ ਸਾਰੀਆਂ ਮੁਸ਼ਕਿਲਾਂ ਹੱਲ ਹੋ ਜਾਨ।

 

Sadly I have seen a lot of times missionaries resort to such tactics as to intentionally offend other Sikhs that they do not agree with them like calling Dasam Granth as Gandh Granth, Gandh da Tokra and recently I saw a picture of bachitar naatak in a very dirty gutter and the missionary who did this Beadvi writes this is what all Sikhs need to do.

 

What is the need for missionaries to do all of this? What will they gain other than make Sikhs fight one another. 20 years ago Sikhs were never fighting with each other over such religious issues as they are now.

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12 minutes ago, Jonny101 said:

Personally no. I don't support the thaali aarti either. But there is a way to get your views across without actually doing what the man in the picture did by physically trying to stop their tradition. That is beadvi in the eyes of Hazuri Sikhs present there.  ਜੇ ਦਲੀਲ ਨਾਲ ਗੱਲ ਹੋਵੇ ਤਾਂ ਸਾਡੀਆਂ ਸਾਰੀਆਂ ਮੁਸ਼ਕਿਲਾਂ ਹੱਲ ਹੋ ਜਾਨ।

 

Sadly I have seen a lot of times missionaries resort to such tactics as to intentionally offend other Sikhs that they do not agree with them like calling Dasam Granth as Gandh Granth, Gandh da Tokra and recently I saw a picture of bachitar naatak in a very dirty gutter and the missionary who did this Beadvi writes this is what all Sikhs need to do.

 

What is the need for missionaries to do all of this? What will they gain other than make Sikhs fight one another. 20 years ago Sikhs were never fighting with each other over such religious issues as they are now.

This is disgusting . Why do these "missionaries" never do anything positive. 

Dasam ki baani is uncompromisingly monotheistic . The hindu gods are merely a reference and subservient to Parbrahm aka  waheguru. 

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4 minutes ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

This is disgusting . Why do these "missionaries" never do anything positive. 

Dasam ki baani is uncompromisingly monotheistic . The hindu gods are merely a reference and subservient to Parbrahm aka  waheguru. 

They attack the section called Charitropakhyan calling it pornography. It is actually linked to the play of maya or illusion. 

 

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1 hour ago, Dsinghdp said:

They attack the section called Charitropakhyan calling it pornography. It is actually linked to the play of maya or illusion. 

 

Rather than deeply understanding maharaj's baani, they attack it . what a shame . 

I have not read charitropakhyan but if its in dasam granth, I don't think it can be bad. 

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10 hours ago, JSinghnz said:

People like you show where they have come from with their language. ..... gutter. 

That is the truth, I am from the gutter, I am also the crap on your drain. 

Jsinghz, art of elusive fighting put up a post saying they would pay for a flight for any nindak like yourself to go to hazoor sahib and tell the hazooris right from wrong. Te truth is you wouldn't, you would give it large on this forum about how only what fits into your beliefs is the truth. &I anything that doesn't fit into your narrow pathetic beliefs of sikhi is false. 

What kind of Khalsa are you? You most likely bow down to your Sri sahib an keep a takht for shastars and worship them how Hindus worship murtis. Truth is real shastar puja is learning how to use various weapons not just showing ritual respect. That's what makes me and you different. 

Rattan Singh bhangu uses the word gandu many times. There is a quote about akali of the past and how they would verbally abuse others. 

 

Akali baba bali Singh in various videos online uses abusive language , maybe a gursikh pyara like him came from the gutter also. 

 

Matter of fact is hazooris and nihangs have done aarti like this for years, anyone that tries to stop them ...well I wouldn't like to think of your haal after that!!

please go and cry into your pillow

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7 hours ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

This is disgusting . Why do these "missionaries" never do anything positive. 

Dasam ki baani is uncompromisingly monotheistic . The hindu gods are merely a reference and subservient to Parbrahm aka  waheguru. 

The question should be, why do sangat go to see these missionaries speak rubbish? Why do gurdwareh book them ? We should not support nindaks like these two. Dandianwala is a nindak for what he said about ragra and singhs doing jhatka. He sold his soul popularity. He is a kotha nothing more.

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2 hours ago, pardesanbibbi said:

When they do the Arti they are reciting the Gurbani, so, there is nothing wrong with that. It is a blessing to recite the Gurbani so who are we to critize them?  They are only invoking God as far as I am concerned. They recite the supplication of Bhagat Dhanna Ji, composition by Bhagat Ravidas Ji, Sant Sain ji, Bhagat kabir Ji and end it with Dasam Patshah's Bani. Why critize others for worshipping God in their own way and from their hearts? They do it so exquisitely because the act itself is so exquisite.

It is what is inside that matters most and they clearly do it from inside..... I believe.

What a joke of a post. So they are doing from  " inside"

the nonsensical hindu ritualistic arti from  "outside."

When will we get rid of this anti gurmat practices?

The Panthic Sikh Rehit Maryada, the official Sikh Code of Conduct, is very clear and states

d. Anything except the afore-mentioned reverential ceremonies, for instance, such practices as the Aarti (waving of a platter with burning lamps and incense set in it in vertical circular motion) with burning incense and lamps, offerings of eatables to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, burning of lights, beating of gongs, etc., is contrary to Gurmat (the Guru’s way). However, for the perfuming of the place, the use of flowers, incense and scent is not barred. For light inside the room, oil or butter-oil lamps, candles, electric lamps, kerosene oil lamps, etc., may he lighted.

 

 

 

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12 hours ago, pardesanbibbi said:

 They are only invoking God as far as I am concerned. 

Shaking in your yoga pants already!!!! Better start doing real exercises, things are going to get real, really quick for you here.

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17 hours ago, JSinghnz said:

the nonsensical hindu ritualistic arti from  "outside."

When will we get rid of this anti gurmat practices?

The Panthic Sikh Rehit Maryada, the official Sikh Code of Conduct, is very clear and states

d. Anything except the afore-mentioned reverential ceremonies, for instance, such practices as the Aarti (waving of a platter with burning lamps and incense set in it in vertical circular motion) with burning incense and lamps, offerings of eatables to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, burning of lights, beating of gongs, etc., is contrary to Gurmat (the Guru’s way). However, for the perfuming of the place, the use of flowers, incense and scent is not barred. For light inside the room, oil or butter-oil lamps, candles, electric lamps, kerosene oil lamps, etc., may he lighted.

Do the interpretation of the aarti shabad in sohila sahib and stop and think at the tuk about chaur sahib. Really take the time to think about what you will be writing down.  I will be waiting for your interpretation.

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