Would you call our moneh boys "sikhs" ?

[Akalifauj]

11 hours ago, dallysingh101 said:

This is all cyclic. Once any actual fighting has to be done (in the UK at least), they'll quickly lose their arrogance and act like best pals. 

What is weird though is that indifference between sehajdharis and amritdharis has reached a level I've never witnessed before in the UK.  

That all being said, I have noticed apnay (keshdharis and amritdharis) going out of their way to acknowledge me in the last few weeks in London. I think many with brains can sense that things might kick off and know they are vastly outnumbered on all sides - so they'd better get all the help they can. Maybe the majority of the snide, resenting type of amritdhari reside on the internet forums as angry trolls, whilst the rest either don't give a crap about this issue or have more realistic conceptualisations of the wider community? 

A keshdhari boy from a not so strict family once told me that these people resent others because they feel imprisoned themselves and resent the perceived 'freedom' or laxity they think others have. If people are feeling that way about following their faith - it's sad. 

For one second moni ji giddar da putt can't stop insulting amritdharis.  This is deep rooted hate.  What happened moni ji, did a amritdhari take your girl away.  This guy is weak at heart.  How do I know?  Because guys who have strength never boost about being tough like this guy.  They don't boost like this internet warrior because they know their strength and rather use words to resolve issues.  They know they can smash a guys head in 10 seconds flat but rather not because they don't waste their time on internet warriors, like moni.  I have seen people like moni being smashed because they thought a cheap shot will work.  Its the reality these giddars face because of their doing. This guys is a uncle, I mean a late 40 year old uncle and he's coming on sikh forums to call Sikh amritdhari youth weak and afraid.  Why does he do this? Because he's weak at heart and can't follow Gurus hukam.  Its been some 20 years and he still can't keep hair uncut but he's got the strength to come on sikh forums to knock down amritdharis.  There is not a bigger coward on sikh forum sites than this guy. He has one goal, he's already sunk into the deep pit of hell and knows it and now he's on a mission to drag others down with him.  Read this moni's post and they are majority about putting down Gurmat.  Whether regarding Gurbani, history, rehat maryada, you name it all about turning people against Gurmat.  Christians talk about the devil, this guy is slave of the devil.  He has no respect for anyone or anything and especially not Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji.

[jkvlondon]

17 hours ago, dallysingh101 said:

Let me offer a possible explanation. His faith was drummed into him, but didn't reach his core. Instead, inside he yearned for a less demanding, 'sophisticated' lifestyle. Fast forward to adulthood. He know tries to fuse his Sikh upbringing with his desired lifestyle - wallah! You have an amritdhari coconut. 

You ever seen the phenomena of how you can start a new job and see there is one keshdhari guy there, who is well fitted in with the whites. This guy (or girl) then goes into a  complete panic when they see you and go overboard to reassure their white pals they are one of them. lol!

I see this so much. Kids brought up strictly, growing up and going absolutely mental in the other direction. It's not a good idea to raise kids like that in my opinion. 

actually due to working across town , Mum and Dad didn't have the same input like you think , he always had non-sikh friends growing up did minimal paat and when he went to uni predominately white friends. He has married a dastarwali bibi out of his choice (love marriage) she is also a coconut but will do the Indian thing if it suits her (I know birds of a feather).

He refers to us as 'you Indians'  yep we have a good laugh at that. He's an architect so I guess he mixes with a certain type of people and is sniffy about his starting point which frankly he needs to get major ish kicked out of him since it was Mum's machine sewing and dad's grocery that paid for his ungrateful A$$ to get where he got. 

Anyway because she is a socialising sikh he has started doing his banian and going to programs ...one good thing 

But lately he tries to Lord it over Mum with his interpretation of what izzat and family values should be , of course he seems to believe that the Mother he abandoned should somehow be consulting him on how to proceed. kal ka shokaraa , akkl gitte'ch showing disrespect to his elders then wants to be the big I am SMH

[Singh1989]

20 hours ago, Destruction said:

Gosh. The way some amritdharis go on its like they believe the stalk dropped them off today etc families. Sehjdhari Sikhs and moneh have been replenishing the Khalsa stock for centuries. What a way to side line majority of the panth.

why do some amritdharis act like they are gods gifts? So much ego and anger towards non Khalsa...is that what your panj pyare and parents taught you ?

This man passed away he, his son and daughter in law were acting like God's gift. During family gathering/ prayer session at their house the old man literally frowned on seeing monehs. Daughter in law n his son spoke to everyone equally, but they forced others into keeping hair/ take Amrit. Not sure about my dad but my mum got compelled by the daughter's words n took Amrit. She was never happy kno wha am saying? Even today she speaks of leaving Amrit behind. I was a kid then never knew reasons why mum took Amrit.

Anyways, the old man? Majority of his grandson's are moneh! When he died they all cut their hair. And his eldest granddaughter?? MARRIED A WHITE MAN KEEPS BOY'S HAIRSTYLE!!! (Daughter of his daughter in law)...

SANGAT JIO! something to think about, why force/ compel n pester others? THEY ARE ADULTS AND KNOW ABOUT AMRIT/ PRAYERS!

[ipledgeblue]

A solution is, if amrit-dharis followed rehit, IF, then, only then more people might want to be Singhs.

When I say rehit, I don't mean just the paper rehit maryada people have now. I mean following the active lifestyle rehit like in the rehitnaamas, rehit that has been followed since Guru Hargobind. Doing things like learning archery, shooting, horse-riding etc Follow Gurus hukam of learning shastar everyday, and also learn martial arts. (See Nihang Singh dals for example)

Instead of being people that religiously follow football and cricket matches, they would be involved in these activities. Then they would be an actual "practising" amrit dhari, as opposed to someone who took amrit just to do paat, which any sehajdhari or "mona" can actually do! Can gurdwaras and sikh associations organise such activities? Organising kabaddi tournaments isn't really going  to make sangat proper amrit dharis. However, organising kabaddi and wrestling training for sangat to be involved in would help!

WE absolutely should not act like the disarmed sikhs of colonial times. Instead of becoming like the naamdharis who put the kirpaan symbol in the kanga, we should get out of this colonial compromise of not following martial rehit and get back to actually being Singhs. Can the community do this?

[dallysingh101]

22 minutes ago, ipledgeblue said:

A solution is, if amrit-dharis followed rehit, IF, then, only then more people might want to be Singhs.

When I say rehit, I don't mean just the paper rehit maryada people have now. I mean following the active lifestyle rehit like in the rehitnaamas, rehit that has been followed since Guru Hargobind. Doing things like learning archery, shooting, horse-riding etc Follow Gurus hukam of learning shastar everyday, and also learn martial arts. (See Nihang Singh dals for example)

Instead of being people that religiously follow football and cricket matches, they would be involved in these activities. Then they would be an actual "practising" amrit dhari, as opposed to someone who took amrit just to do paat, which any sehajdhari or "mona" can actually do! Can gurdwaras and sikh associations organise such activities? Organising kabaddi tournaments isn't really going  to make sangat proper amrit dharis. However, organising kabaddi and wrestling training for sangat to be involved in would help!

WE absolutely should not act like the disarmed sikhs of colonial times. Instead of becoming like the naamdharis who put the kirpaan symbol in the kanga, we should get out of this colonial compromise of not following martial rehit and get back to actually being Singhs. Can the community do this?

I think you've hit the nail on the head here. 

[Destruction]

2 hours ago, ipledgeblue said:

A solution is, if amrit-dharis followed rehit, IF, then, only then more people might want to be Singhs.

When I say rehit, I don't mean just the paper rehit maryada people have now. I mean following the active lifestyle rehit like in the rehitnaamas, rehit that has been followed since Guru Hargobind. Doing things like learning archery, shooting, horse-riding etc Follow Gurus hukam of learning shastar everyday, and also learn martial arts. (See Nihang Singh dals for example)

Instead of being people that religiously follow football and cricket matches, they would be involved in these activities. Then they would be an actual "practising" amrit dhari, as opposed to someone who took amrit just to do paat, which any sehajdhari or "mona" can actually do! Can gurdwaras and sikh associations organise such activities? Organising kabaddi tournaments isn't really going  to make sangat proper amrit dharis. However, organising kabaddi and wrestling training for sangat to be involved in would help!

WE absolutely should not act like the disarmed sikhs of colonial times. Instead of becoming like the naamdharis who put the kirpaan symbol in the kanga, we should get out of this colonial compromise of not following martial rehit and get back to actually being Singhs. Can the community do this?

Great post.howver politics and different jathe are the problem. You think an akj would go to a taksali to learn knowledge from or vice versa? We should be honest that we will never be a martial race we have lost it. People are too busy at the gym to look good for women, not for nitty gritty violence. 

We have people cussing shastar vidiya claiming it is all fake just because they might not agree with the teacher and his beliefs. Yet Nidar Singh has taken the vidiya away from Sikhs and given it to non Sikhs globally because they appreciate it much more than Sikhs. Who is to blame? Us, mainly Akjs and fanatics who are narrow minded.

We we have a worse slave mentality than the blacks as we are to blame. Well those in charge such as sgpc and anyone with a platform to speak to sangat. 

It was a good post until the nihangs dals... They only have horse riding or minimum archery at best. They are past their sell by date only because they've taken up gatka as their means of vidiya. It's embarrassing seeing sings jump around cutting melons and whatnot. For me personally 95% of gurdwareh are a business. How much money from the golak goes back into the community? I'm not on about Punjabi lessons. Something like teaching kids to plant ,grow food? organic BtW.

teaching them about reality of life how to deal with finances saving for the future

giving them real history stories rather than their Disney version of sikhi which most packaraks do.

fair enough hunting is out of the question for most Sikhs as they are strict vegetarians...but why order a veggie burger which is made to taste like chicken? Or why eat something which mimics meat???? If meat is about taste of the tongue being a veggie is anything different?

there is various points which have made us spineless, fanatic about being a vegetarian, use of harmonium rather than string instruments, different beliefs of various groups which has created hate for different groups of Sikhs. 

[jkvlondon]

4 hours ago, Destruction said:

Great post.howver politics and different jathe are the problem. You think an akj would go to a taksali to learn knowledge from or vice versa? We should be honest that we will never be a martial race we have lost it. People are too busy at the gym to look good for women, not for nitty gritty violence. 

We have people cussing shastar vidiya claiming it is all fake just because they might not agree with the teacher and his beliefs. Yet Nidar Singh has taken the vidiya away from Sikhs and given it to non Sikhs globally because they appreciate it much more than Sikhs. Who is to blame? Us, mainly Akjs and fanatics who are narrow minded.

We we have a worse slave mentality than the blacks as we are to blame. Well those in charge such as sgpc and anyone with a platform to speak to sangat. 

It was a good post until the nihangs dals... They only have horse riding or minimum archery at best. They are past their sell by date only because they've taken up gatka as their means of vidiya. It's embarrassing seeing sings jump around cutting melons and whatnot. For me personally 95% of gurdwareh are a business. How much money from the golak goes back into the community? I'm not on about Punjabi lessons. Something like teaching kids to plant ,grow food? organic BtW.

teaching them about reality of life how to deal with finances saving for the future

giving them real history stories rather than their Disney version of sikhi which most packaraks do.

fair enough hunting is out of the question for most Sikhs as they are strict vegetarians...but why order a veggie burger which is made to taste like chicken? Or why eat something which mimics meat???? If meat is about taste of the tongue being a veggie is anything different?

there is various points which have made us spineless, fanatic about being a vegetarian, use of harmonium rather than string instruments, different beliefs of various groups which has created hate for different groups of Sikhs. 

yes I believe anyone from akj would happily go and get santhiya from taksalis  , and taksalis kirtan from akj kirtaniyas , most folks are not strict on jatha allegiance in my experience. Those who are prejudiced  are unable to respect their Guru pita ji and see sisters and brothers in the panth and thus fail in a vital aspect of being Khalsa.

Why could we not revive the martial spirit ?,  we could learn from older indian/asian arts even persian archery, sword techniques to reconstruct the missing/diluted skills. Of course it doesn't stop there need to be able to shoot etc, be strong, able to think on their feet, have herbal knowledge, survival skills the list is long.

We in the west should be helping the less well off sikhs like the farmers, mazhabi and sikhligar brothers and sisters instead of filling golaks which are corrupting the committees

[ipledgeblue]

I think the jatha segregation should not limit sikh gurdwaras and community groups from organising Khalsa rehit activities. 

I mentioned Nihang dals as they do still have a type of active Khalsa lifestyle. This is better than those that believe maryada is just doing daily nitnem and fiddling about with harmoniums to create sounds that we are now calling keertan. Not to mention amrit dharis that say they are vegetarians but eat countless harmful foods containing sugars and carbohydrates giving them diabetes, what kind of gurmat is that???

[dallysingh101]

What about gays? Would people call them Sikhs? 

[harkirat23]

They are only human.