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Just now, Sukhvirk1976 said:

You haven't provided any evidence.. Please show me the details that I can read 

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ere is an old write-up by someone posted on this form many years ago.

Even the present head of Baba Farid Jee’s spiritual order Prof. Khalil Nizami says the bani in Guru Granth Sahib Jee is that of Farid Sani. Bhai Vir Singh Jee, Prof. Teja Singh Jee, and Budh Singh all agree to this opinion that the Bani written in Guru Granth Sahib jee is that of Farid Sani the contemporary of Guru Nanak Dev Jee, and not Baba Farid the Afghan who lived during the 12th century.

The proof of Baba Farid Jee meeting Guru Nanak Dev Jee is his Bani. Fareed Jee writes:

JO GUR DASAY WAATH MUREEDA JOLEA|| (Asa sheikh farid 477)

KAR KIRPA PRAB SAADHSANG MELEE|| (Farid soohi 794)

Muslim sufis never use words such as Gur, Saadh or "Prabh". According to a book written by Prof. Khalil Nizami spiritual head of Baba Farid Jee’s spiritual order these words were written by Farid Sani because he was heavily influenced by Guru Nanak Dev jee, this is confirmed by the writer of "Swanay Farid".

Proof from Janamsakhis, then ponder on the following Janamsakhi which mentions Guru Jee meeting with Farid Jee:

SRI GURU BABA AUTHOU CHALIA|

RAAVI CHANOU DEKH KAR AUJARH PAI CHALIA|

PATTAN DESH AIE NIKALIA|

PATTAN TO KOS TIN AUJARH THI, AUTHAY AIE BAITHAA|

MARDANA NAAL AAHA, PATTAN DHA PIR SHEIKH FARID THA TISKAY TAKHT SHEIKH BRAM (IBRAHIM) THA| (Puraatan Janam Sakhi)

-Besides this Janamsakhi, another Janamsakhi by the name of “Meherban Vali Janamsakhi” tells of a story of when Baba Farid jee once went to collect wood and there he also ran into Guru Nanak Dev Jee reciting the following Gurbani Tukhs:

APAY PATTEE KALAM AAP, UPAR LEKH BHI THU||

EKO KAHIAE NANAKAA, DOOJA KAHAY KOO|| (Malar dhi vaar M: 1 -1291)

-Another Janamsakhi which is now safely at Guru Nanak Dev University taken from the UK also mentions a meeting between Guru Nanak Dev Jee and Baba Farid jee.

-Another Janamasakhi, Bhai Mani Singh Jee vali Janamsakhi mentions a meeting between Guru Nanak Dev Jee and Baba Farid Jee.

I have given names of four different Janamsakhis all mentioning Baba Farid jee meeting with Guru Nanak Dev Jee.

1) All Pakistani scholars agree that this Baba Farid jee did not write any baani at all. He was not a poet.

2) He was not a native of Punjab and as such could not have written such purely native countryside Punjabi. It is like asserting that Shakespeare was not English but a German writer. A non-English person could not have written what Shakespeare wrote. Same way, a non-Punjabi could not have written the kind of Punjabi that is in Gurbani under Baba Farid jee name.

3) The Punjabi used in Baba Farid jee’s baani in Siri Guru Granth Sahib jee is of the same time as Guru Nanak Sahib jee. All linguistics agree to this. If this baani had been written 300 years before Siri Guru Nanak Dev jee, it would have been drastically different. Just compare the Punjabi written today to Punjabi of Siri Guru Gobind Singh jee’s times.

4) Farid Shakarganj i.e. the Senior Farid, was a staunch Muslim who converted thousands of Hindus to Islam. He was very strict in Sharia and he would have never used non-Islamic words like “Saadh” in his baani.

Now the question arises that if the baani in Siri Guru Granth Sahib jee was not written by Baba Farid Shakarganj then who is the writer of this baani? The answer is very simple. As written in the Janamsaakhis, the writer of this baani was Farid Saani, who was sitting on the gaddi of the original Farid. His name was Sheikh Ibrahim but he was also known as Farid Saani and it was he who met Siri Guru Nanak Dev jee Maharaaj.

It is this Sheikh Ibrahim, whose spiritual thirst was quenched by Siri Guru Nanak Dev jee. He wrote the following shabad to Siri Guru Nanak Dev jee:

soohee lalith ||

baerraa ba(n)dhh n sakiou ba(n)dhhan kee vaelaa ||

.

bhar saravar jab ooshhalai thab tharan dhuhaelaa ||1||

hathh n laae kasu(n)bharrai jal jaasee dtolaa ||1|| rehaao ||

eik aapeenhai pathalee seh kaerae bolaa ||

dhudhhaa thhanee n aavee fir hoe n maelaa ||2||

kehai fareedh sehaeleeho sahu alaaeaesee ||

ha(n)s chalasee ddu(n)manaa ahi than dtaeree thheesee ||3||2||

This shabad of Baba Farid jee portrays the thirst of Baba jee very clearly. He is literally begging for spirituality. In response to this shabad, Siri Guru Nanak Dev jee wrote the following shabad:

soohee mehalaa 1 ||

jap thap kaa ba(n)dhh baerrulaa jith la(n)ghehi vehaelaa ||

naa saravar naa ooshhalai aisaa pa(n)thh suhaelaa ||1||

thaeraa eaeko naam ma(n)jeet(h)arraa rathaa maeraa cholaa sadh ra(n)g dtolaa ||1|| rehaao ||

saajan chalae piaariaa kio maelaa hoee ||

jae gun hovehi ga(n)t(h)arreeai maelaegaa soee ||2||

miliaa hoe n veeshhurrai jae miliaa hoee ||

aavaa goun nivaariaa hai saachaa soee ||3||

houmai maar nivaariaa seethaa hai cholaa ||

gur bachanee fal paaeiaa seh kae a(n)mrith bolaa ||4||

naanak kehai sehaeleeho sahu kharaa piaaraa ||

ham seh kaereeaa dhaaseeaa saachaa khasam hamaaraa ||5||2||4||

He cries that “bhar Sarvar jabb uchhalai, tabb taran dulela” but Guru Baba jee says “Na sarvar na uchhalai, aisa panth suhela”. He says that his spiritual path is very hard but Siri Guru jee says that the Gurmat path is very easy and full of bliss.

He says "BeRa bandh na sakhiyo" Siri Guru jee says, "Jap tap ka bandh beRla". He says that he has not been able to build his ship to swim across this ocean of world. Siri Guru jee says that if he has not build it yet, then he can now build the ship of Jap-Tap. What a great shabad Siri Guru jee's is! Just amazing. This shabad is most beautiful. I wish some gursikh sing this shabad and I may just listen to it till eternity.

Just compare the two shabads and no one can deny that one was written in response to the other one.

After hearing Siri Guru jee’s shabad, Farid Saani jee became disciple of Guru Nanak Paatshaah. There is no doubt about it. Sirii Guru jee and he met 3 times in total.

 

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6 minutes ago, Sukhvirk1976 said:

Your entire proposition is flawed and yet you still rage 

MY proposition is flawed? ok then. Please go through that post bit by bit and point out where the flaws are, point out where in that quote that this Farid wasn't the contemporary of Guru Nanak Dev Ji. You simply decided off the top of your head that it was the Baba from 350 years ago. So prove it.  All you do is making sweeping statements and have nothing to back it up. I'm not even raging, I'm just baffled someone is so clueless about the very history they come here to discuss.

 

http://www.vidhia.com/Bhai Veer Singh Ji/Puratan Janam Sakhi Shri Guru Nanak Dev Ji-Bhai Vir Singh Punjabi.pdf

 

Here you go. Purtan Jaman Sakhis from the 19th Century done by a Historian who also agrees with me. So please, go on. Refute him and dissect his evidence.

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Just now, Kira said:

MY proposition is flawed? ok then. Please go through that post bit by bit and point out where the flaws are. You simply decided off the top of your head that it was the Baba from 350 years ago. So prove it. 

I could go on and on and systematically undermine it.. Your whole assumption is is based on the idea that to be recognized as a Sikh bhagats would have needed to firstly have met Guru sahib and secondly taken Charan Pahul ie. Amrit... If sikhi and guru nanak dev ji  teaches us we should move beyond such labels why would he compel people to do that!? 

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6 minutes ago, Kira said:

MY proposition is flawed? ok then. Please go through that post bit by bit and point out where the flaws are, point out where in that quote that this Farid wasn't the contemporary of Guru Nanak Dev Ji. You simply decided off the top of your head that it was the Baba from 350 years ago. So prove it.  All you do is making sweeping statements and have nothing to back it up. I'm not even raging, I'm just baffled someone is so clueless about the very history they come here to discuss.

 

http://www.vidhia.com/Bhai Veer Singh Ji/Puratan Janam Sakhi Shri Guru Nanak Dev Ji-Bhai Vir Singh Punjabi.pdf

 

Here you go. Purtan Jaman Sakhis from the 19th Century done by a Historian who also agrees with me. So please, go on. Refute him and dissect his evidence.

So you have a source that apparently agrees with you... What about sources that show no evidence of it at all 

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2 minutes ago, Sukhvirk1976 said:

I could go on and on and systematically undermine it.. Your whole assumption is is based on the idea that to be recognized as a Sikh bhagats would have needed to firstly have met Guru sahib and secondly taken Charan Pahul ie. Amrit... If sikhi and guru nanak dev ji  teaches us we should move beyond such labels why would he compel people to do that!? 

You keep repeating the same thing yet you provide no evidence for anything you say. Right. Continue to flaunt hot air, if Labels were so bad then why does Bhai Gurdas Ji use them, why does Gurbani use them. "systematically undermine it" Don't make me laugh. You tried to assert Farid Ji wasn't a Sikh and that went badly. Now you have evidence that you were talking about the wrong Farid Ji so you decide to just ignore it and say "i can undermine it" 

ok then kiddo.

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8 minutes ago, Kira said:

MY proposition is flawed? ok then. Please go through that post bit by bit and point out where the flaws are, point out where in that quote that this Farid wasn't the contemporary of Guru Nanak Dev Ji. You simply decided off the top of your head that it was the Baba from 350 years ago. So prove it.  All you do is making sweeping statements and have nothing to back it up. I'm not even raging, I'm just baffled someone is so clueless about the very history they come here to discuss.

 

http://www.vidhia.com/Bhai Veer Singh Ji/Puratan Janam Sakhi Shri Guru Nanak Dev Ji-Bhai Vir Singh Punjabi.pdf

 

Here you go. Purtan Jaman Sakhis from the 19th Century done by a Historian who also agrees with me. So please, go on. Refute him and dissect his evidence.

Please show me where I should look in the source you have provided.. 

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Just now, Kira said:

You keep repeating the same thing yet you provide no evidence for anything you say. Right. Continue to flaunt hot air, if Labels were so bad then why does Bhai Gurdas Ji use them, why does Gurbani use them. "systematically undermine it" Don't make me laugh. You tried to assert Farid Ji wasn't a Sikh and that went badly. Now you have evidence that you were talking about the wrong Farid Ji so you decide to just ignore it and say "i can undermine it" 

ok then kiddo.

I didn't say he wasn't a Sikh! I just don't believe in your narrow definition of the term

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