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MisterrSingh

Compassion & Tolerance Vs Common Sense & Self-preservation

32 posts in this topic

10 minutes ago, MisterrSingh said:

Thanks, that's a brilliant post that's got me thinking about a lot. 

So basically I've got to de-program and unlearn everything pertaining to this issue, that's been drummed into me since childhood as a result of being born in the West, and then re-learn it from the Eastern perspective? Oh god, lol.

We must unlearn what we have learnt.

The Western ways are not without it's merits and it does have it's uses.

Some of these truths were already known in the west through Greek and Roman Philosophy.

But I think the Abrahamic thinking and mindset has definitely stunted the spiritualism in the West.

I think if you read bani without the western filter and read it with your intuition things will make a lot more sense.

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On 4/1/2017 at 3:44 PM, MisterrSingh said:

Thanks, that's a brilliant post that's got me thinking about a lot. 

So basically I've got to de-program and unlearn everything pertaining to this issue, that's been drummed into me since childhood as a result of being born in the West, and then re-learn it from the Eastern perspective? Oh god, lol.

You're lucky mate. It's easier than you think (but not easy if you know what I mean). Once you go through it, you'll start seeing and experiencing our thing like it was supposed to be seen and experienced. All that dogma falls in place. It's like finally coming from underneath an uncomfortable shadow you've been born under. It's liberating. 

BTW, the faulty conceptions don't arise from being born in the west, rather because Sikhi was projected a certain way (i.e. as 'Sikhism') by articulate, patronised (in both senses of the word) and powerful Sikhs during colonialism. Their conceptualisations still form (or at least influence) majority thought in our community today. I'm not saying they got everything wrong, but hammering our heritage to an outsiders framework has changed it. 

 

Edited by dallysingh101
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26 minutes ago, dallysingh101 said:

BTW, the faulty conceptions don't arise from being born in the west, rather because Sikhi was projected a certain way (i.e. as 'Sikhism') by articulate, patronised (in both senses of the word) and powerful Sikhs during colonialism. Their conceptualisations still form (or at least influence) majority thought in our community today. I'm saying they got everything wrong, but hammering our heritage to an outsiders framework has changed it. 

I'm not sure who I should be more irritated with: the colonialists or the sellouts from within our ranks, lol. 

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1 hour ago, MisterrSingh said:

Thanks, that's a brilliant post that's got me thinking about a lot. 

So basically I've got to de-program and unlearn everything pertaining to this issue, that's been drummed into me since childhood as a result of being born in the West, and then re-learn it from the Eastern perspective? Oh god, lol.

We are still blessed because our Gurus actually wrote and checked Bani; if you compare that to the 3 Abrahamic religions; they've lost the original teachings of their prophets; (Judaism is on the same verge of collapse especially since they contradict the Torah's own prophesies). Also no body really knows the real teachings of Buddha; or actual Hinduism and Jainism. If you read simply Japji Sahib you are more blessed than every Non-Sikh out there, because it's actually written by Guru Sahib himself. And we know the fate of all of those tribal religions: :@ they got extinct and only exist as cosplay where you can dress like those tribal devti.:@It's a bit silly though,:rofl but you can't learn about those religions actual beliefs even if you wanted to.:/

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On 31/03/2017 at 1:35 PM, MisterrSingh said:

I came across a couple of unfortunate incidents in the news recently that served to get me thinking about issues that i suppose go to the heart of Sikh philosophy. We are instructed not to veer towards extremes; that the correct path is the balanced, considered middle way. Sikhi is as much a faith about standing up for oneself and battling for those who cannot defend themselves, as it is a faith that believes that love and kindness are essential traits if we are to live fruitful lives, and eventually merge with God.

How does one decide which situation merits a particular approach? Some Sikhs would have us believe that the default position must always be the one of tolerance and kindness even in the face of the overwhelming likelihood of serious harm befalling the individual who refuses to be mindful of their own welfare, instead choosing to believe in the goodness of others even when the evidence points to the contrary. 

Is it the right option to "be good" but then suffer terribly as a consequence, or should we be selective with our charitable nature, and only be forthcoming dependent on the situation before us? Which way would bring us closer to God's graces? 

Here's two recent instances that got me thinking. All opinions welcome.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/03/30/mother-son-die-triple-stabbing-home/

http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2017/03/white_social_justice_warrior_dies_at_hands_of_black_killer_.html

First: A wealthy family begin providing the local homeless with a roof over their heads by taking them into their own considerably plush home. Yesterday, allegedly, the latest homeless man who was lodging with them went on a rampage, and killed the mother and son of the family. The father was found stabbed and bleeding in the driveway.

Second: A white social activist heavily involved in the liberal scene of upper middle class activism was robbed, stabbed, tortured, and murdered by a black man. She spent most of her days espousing on social media about the evils of whiteness, and that black society was a perpetual victim of the insidiousness of white America. She refused to accept that there could ever be bad apples in the black community. She met her end alone and in an utterly tragic manner. 

Edit: In the case of the American woman, i was initially reluctant to use a right-wing website as the source, but all other sites and reports neglected to mention her political views and opinions that she shared on social media. For some reason they only seemed to highlight her work as an artist but not her beliefs. A lot was glossed over or completely ignored in the case of the lady in question.

 

Selective charity is the best approach I find personally. To be charitable to everyone or the really undeserving is not going to help you or that person in the long run. In nature we can see a snake will always be a snake and try to attack you because its been programmed to do so, you cant change its nature or DNA. Just as a low life murderous / rapist  criminal who has been brought up and raised with wrong programming in his/her mind will find it very difficult to be a good person especially if they haven't been reprogrammed by "good" religious teachings for a long time.

For us sikhs the middle path is best and what sikhi teaches to be balanced and rational human beings to learn the ways of the world not to be like ostrich sticking our heads in the sands and letting ourselves get caught up in events that we should have seen coming. Our ideology is not mentally insane inhumane immoral violence like islam nor mostly pacifist beliefs like Christianity (turn the other cheek), buddhism and jainism.

In Sikhism there is provision for extreme deadly violence in scriptures (e.g sikh national anthem and gurbani glorying warriors who may be cut limb by limb but never flee battlefield in defense of the Sikh religion, etc).
As the old english saying goes no good deed goes without being punished. Meaning those who do good will eventually be punished with evil visiting them. We can see that is true in life that good people who do good deeds often get victimised by evil forces. And that is where Sikhi teaches us that violence can be used against those evil forces if all the means of reason or to stop the tyranny goes without any success.

Maybe its a way to pay their karmic debts but we know in Sikh theology and history that is how Sikhs have understood it. Whenever bad things happen to people it is karma for there past or present bad deeds and they just have to accept it. Even "bad events" are gifts as Guru Nanak dev ji explains in japji sahib, we humans cant comprehend them as gifts because they have a negative impact on us but I guess that is how our karmic debts are repaid so that our souls may be purified for the next stage in our spiritual journey.

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Every reply in this thread has been cracking. Great contributions; lots to think over and absorb.

It's also clear to me how easy it is to veer off course when trying to understand the absolute core of what Sikhi is telling us. We, as humans, impose our pre-existing beliefs, practices, and prejudices on matters that the nuances of which are - as the saying goes - finer than a hair's breadth. The distinction between what's correct and what's inaccurate is such a fine line to tread.

Unlike other faiths we perhaps don't portend doom for people around us and humanity in general if our comprehension of Sikhi isn't as firm as it should be, but for the sake of establishing clarity in our own minds, and therefore allowing us to be productive and good Sikhs and humans in general, we owe it to ourselves to truly comprehend what our faith's scriptures are saying to us, and not arrive at a rough estimation based on skewed information or occasionally outright false assumptions built on things we suppose to be accurate. 

I use to hear it growing up and i didn't quite understand the impact of it, but I'm beginning to realise that Sikhi is truly not an easy path to follow. Of course, the rewards for doing so are in themselves worth undergoing the tough journey.

Edited by MisterrSingh

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4 minutes ago, MisterrSingh said:

Every reply in this thread has been cracking. Great contributions; lots to think over and absorb.

It's also clear to me how easy it is to veer off course when trying to understand the absolute core of what Sikhi is telling us. We, as humans, impose our pre-existing beliefs, practices, and prejudices on matters that the nuances of which are - as the saying goes - finer than a hair's breadth. The distinction between what's correct and what's inaccurate is such a fine line to tread.

Unlike other faiths we perhaps don't portend doom for people around us and humanity in general if our comprehension of Sikhi isn't as firm as it should be, but for the sake of establishing clarity in our own minds, and therefore allowing us to be productive and good Sikhs and humans in general, we owe it to ourselves to truly comprehend what our faith's scriptures are saying to us, and not arrive at a rough estimation based on skewed information or occasionally outright false assumptions built on things we suppose to be accurate. 

I use to hear it growing up and i didn't quite understand the impact of it, but I'm beginning to realise that Sikhi is truly not an easy path to follow. Of course, the rewards for doing so are in themselves worth undergoing the tough journey.

Nothing worthwhile comes easy.

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