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S4NGH

Huddersfield grooming gang 2 "sikhs"

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19 hours ago, S4NGH said:

Partially agree with you veerji.

The media intensifies when the culprits belong to minority groups, especially asian. An obvious bias exists. But there's no point in lashing back with excuses (if the culprits were white or black etc) because of course the same logic applies to us. Let's say these girls were our daughters (which they are but let's say they were sikh) and the groomers were white; pretty certain we'd be out in the 1000s. E.g. Leicester was it above the shop/restaurant? We were all so quick to protest (rightly so) and shame the muslim community (wrong in my opinion. Evil has no religion. But each to their own view. Queue the bashing). However, when our own are involved, we're all hush hush about it. "Mitti pao" cover it up. The exact same attitude the muslim community has shown when dealing with such issues, albeit at a much larger scale. And it's this very attitude that will only come round to bite us later on.

I think people like you (and me) and many others (i.e. Manmohan Singh of SAS), kind of ensure that our people don't bury our heads in the sand to this within our community. 

But yes, overall, our people do appear to have this repeated tendency to avoid facing up to uncomfortable ugly truths within (like grooming, alcoholism, casteism and so on). But we do have people who continual try and shine light on these matters. It just seems to take forever to get our lot to recognise serious internal problems. We do have this 'ostrich mentality'.  

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On Saturday, April 01, 2017 at 9:51 PM, S4NGH said:

Amere Singh Dhaliwal, 34. Married man, father of two sons. AMRITDHARI Singh.

What number house on Holly Road does he live in?

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5 hours ago, angelleb said:

What number house on Holly Road does he live in?

What you going to do, go down his house and harass his wife and kids, maybe his parents who have go nothing to do with his illegal activities or were you "just asking".

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6 minutes ago, kcmidlands said:

What you going to do, go down his house and harass his wife and kids, maybe his parents who have go nothing to do with his illegal activities or were you "just asking".

I dont believe in harassing women, children or old people but I have got some questions to ask the criminal.

Why are you trying to protect him???

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51 minutes ago, angelleb said:

I dont believe in harassing women, children or old people but I have got some questions to ask the criminal.

Why are you trying to protect him???

That is not his address. He's given the address of a rental home he owns. He lives in Crosland Moor. Amere is also not his full name. Thought he'd be a clever little so and so.

Edited by S4NGH
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53 minutes ago, kcmidlands said:

What you going to do, go down his house and harass his wife and kids, maybe his parents who have go nothing to do with his illegal activities or were you "just asking".

This has nothing to do with his family. I full sympathise with his mother, wife and children.

But he is answerable to the Guru Khalsa. Any member of society has the right to ask questions.

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39 minutes ago, S4NGH said:

That is not his address. He's given the address of a rental home he owns. He lives in Crosland Moor. Amere is also not his full name. Thought he'd be a clever little so and so.

I didnt think Amere was his name, I dont know any punjabis with first name of Amere.

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1 hour ago, angelleb said:

I dont believe in harassing women, children or old people but I have got some questions to ask the criminal.

Why are you trying to protect him???

I have no interest in protecting the guy, i'm not a fan of people trying to take the law into their own hand's that's all, you've asked for the address of someone who's facing criminal charges and is going through the legal system, we don't live in a mob rule society, anybody who has the smallest amount of sense will have question's for people who commit heinous crimes like this (including me) but what on earth are you going to ask him, Why he did it?

31 minutes ago, S4NGH said:

This has nothing to do with his family. I full sympathise with his mother, wife and children.

But he is answerable to the Guru Khalsa. Any member of society has the right to ask questions.

Yes he is answerable, but not to us, but to Waheguru, we are just mere servants, to me he's no more a Sikh than Hitler was a humanitarian.

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45 minutes ago, kcmidlands said:

I have no interest in protecting the guy, i'm not a fan of people trying to take the law into their own hand's that's all, you've asked for the address of someone who's facing criminal charges and is going through the legal system, we don't live in a mob rule society, anybody who has the smallest amount of sense will have question's for people who commit heinous crimes like this (including me) but what on earth are you going to ask him, Why he did it?

Yes he is answerable, but not to us, but to Waheguru, we are just mere servants, to me he's no more a Sikh than Hitler was a humanitarian.

I guess we can agree to disagree then.

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14 minutes ago, S4NGH said:

I guess we can agree to disagree then.

Indeed, that's the whole idea of a debate, we can't always agree.

Edited by kcmidlands
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On 18 April 2017 at 3:21 PM, angelleb said:

I didnt think Amere was his name, I dont know any punjabis with first name of Amere.

I find it surprising that "Amere" has been allowed to mask his full identity under a nickname. After all, the court has decreed that his identity and that of the other defendants should be made public. I do not see therefore that there would be anything wrong in disclosing his full name or other aliases - the other defendants have not been able to hide themselves in this way.

His exact address of course is another matter as the court has not put any more than a street name for the bail addresses in the public domain. The defendants solicitors argued that the street names should not be published but the court refused.

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On 2017-3-30 at 1:24 AM, MisterrSingh said:

They should do the decent thing and convert to Islam. They're more than halfway there. 

you seem to believe uncle ji that all of islam is bad ! 

I used to hate islam and muslims very much until waheguru helped me via a muslim . Some day waheguru ji will send a muslim in your life to help . Then your view will change too 

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On 2017-4-2 at 2:21 AM, S4NGH said:

Amere Singh Dhaliwal, 34. Married man, father of two sons. AMRITDHARI Singh.

In our locality here , there was a strapping young amritdhari who was arrested few months ago on the charges of sexual advances towards a girl . People take amrit for the wrong reasons ! They take amrit but don't do baanis and have no discipline . 

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Several posts on this thread imply that they are shocked that the alleged perverts are amritdhari,but I'm not . The examples given by others of convicted offenders are all amritdharis, and generally in life , in my experience i get the impression amritdharis seem on the whole to be much pervier than those who arent amritdhari . Plus ,perhaps this is related, amritdharis seem in general to be a great deal more sexist than non-amritdharis .

So let's have less of the "omg he's an amritdhari ,I can't believe it ! " ,I very much can believe it (and I expect I'm not the only one ). 

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2 hours ago, ManjitSinghEsq said:

Several posts on this thread imply that they are shocked that the alleged perverts are amritdhari,but I'm not . The examples given by others of convicted offenders are all amritdharis, and generally in life , in my experience i get the impression amritdharis seem on the whole to be much pervier than those who arent amritdhari . Plus ,perhaps this is related, amritdharis seem in general to be a great deal more sexist than non-amritdharis .

So let's have less of the "omg he's an amritdhari ,I can't believe it ! " ,I very much can believe it (and I expect I'm not the only one ). 

I wouldnt go as far as say say all or most Amritdhari's are that way I would say its opposite its a tiny percentage that give the rest a bad name usually because they are not Sikh inside they have just grown their hair long and beard put a pagh on and thought thats all it takes to be a Khalsa. A true Khalsa a true Sikh of the Guru is one whose behaviour and conduct that Guru Ji would be proud of not one that brings shame to the panth.

And as they say never judge a book by its cover, we just need to look at the likes of KPS Gill and other so called "Sikh" sardar punjab police officers past and present. Most of them are often wolfs in sheeps clothing trying to come across someone trustworthy and decent but often corrupt beyond belief.

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    • Here is a pauri by Guru Nanak Dev ji which addresses some of these issues: ਪਉੜੀ ॥ ਸਾਰੰਗ ਕੀ ਵਾਰ: (ਮਃ ੪) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਅੰਗ ੧੨੩੭    ਆਪੇ ਆਪਿ ਨਿਰੰਜਨਾ ਜਿਨਿ ਆਪੁ ਉਪਾਇਆ ॥ The Immaculate Lord Himself, by Himself, created Himself. ਆਪੇ ਖੇਲੁ ਰਚਾਇਓਨੁ ਸਭੁ ਜਗਤੁ ਸਬਾਇਆ ॥ He Himself created the whole drama of all the world's play. ਤ੍ਰੈ ਗੁਣ ਆਪਿ ਸਿਰਜਿਅਨੁ ਮਾਇਆ ਮੋਹੁ ਵਧਾਇਆ ॥ He Himself formed the three gunas, the three qualities; He increased the attachment to Maya. ਗੁਰ ਪਰਸਾਦੀ ਉਬਰੇ ਜਿਨ ਭਾਣਾ ਭਾਇਆ ॥ By Guru's Grace, they are saved - those who love the Will of God. ਨਾਨਕ ਸਚੁ ਵਰਤਦਾ ਸਭ ਸਚਿ ਸਮਾਇਆ ॥੧॥ O Nanak, the True Lord is pervading everywhere; all are contained within the True Lord. ||1||   The shabad states that God created the creation and maya (illusion). The Guru grants Grace and saves those who love God's will. Those who love God's Will will be saved. Meanwhile, the likes of your "friend" will remain entangled in fruitless philosophical arguments. Note: I may quibble with the translation of the first line. Some scholars think that when Gurbani talks of God "creating Himself", it's referring to establishing himself in the Universe.
    • If your "friend" wants to know exactly "how" God created the creation, I would say that that's a totally worthless question. Why does he need to know "how" God created the world and infused with Maya (3 qualities and 5 vices)? Is he planning to create a universe anytime soon? About such philosophical exercises, Guru ji says: ਸਹਸ ਸਿਆਣਪਾ ਲਖ ਹੋਹਿ ਤ ਇਕ ਨ ਚਲੈ ਨਾਲਿ ॥ 
      Hundreds of thousands of clever thoughts, but not even one of them will go along with you in the end. 
    • Your Christian "friend"''s multiple questions basically just boil down to this one question. The answer is simply that God desired to create the world (Maya) as his divine play, called "khel". Principal Sahib Singh, his his Darpan, quoted many lines from Gurbani that reference "khel": ਲਫ਼ਜ਼ ਖੇਲੁ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੰ੍ਰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਵਿਚ ਕਈ ਵਾਰੀ ਆਇਆ ਹੈ; ਪ੍ਰਮਾਣ ਵਜੋਂ 

      ਸੁਪਨੰਤਰੁ ਸੰਸਾਰ ਸਭੁ ਸਭੁ ਬਾਜੀ ਖੇਲੁ ਖਿਲਾਵੈਗੇ ॥ ਲਾਹਾ ਨਾਮੁ ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਲੈ ਚਾਲਹੁ ਹਰਿ ਦਰਗਹ ਪੈਧਾ 
      ਜਾਵੈਗੋ ॥੫॥੫॥ ਕਾਨੜਾ ਮ: ੪ ਅਸਟਪਦੀ 

      ਰਾਮ ਨਾਮੁ ਵਖਰੁ ਹੈ ਊਤਮੁ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਇਕੁ ਪੁਰਖੁ ਹਮਾਰਾ ॥ ਹਰਿ ਖੇਲੁ ਕੀਆ ਹਰਿ ਆਪੇ ਵਰਤੈ ਸਭੁ 
      ਜਗਤੁ ਕੀਆ ਵਣਜਾਰਾ ॥੪॥ ਕਾਨੜੇ ਕੀ ਵਾਰ 

      ਜੈਸੇ ਹਰਹਟ ਕੀ ਮਾਲਾ ਟਿੰਡ ਲਗਤ ਹੈ ॥ ਇਕ ਸਖਨੀ ਹੋਰ ਫੇਰ ਭਰੀਅਤ ਹੈ ॥ ਤੈਸੋ ਹੀ ਇਹ ਖੇਲੁ 
      ਖਸਮ ਕਾ ਜਿਉ ਉਸ ਕੀ ਵਡਿਆਈ ॥੨॥੮॥ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਤੀ ਮ: ੧ 

      ਆਪੇ ਭਾਂਤ ਬਣਾਏ ਬਹੁਰੰਗੀ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਉਪਾਈ ਪ੍ਰਭਿ ਖੇਲੁ ਕੀਆ ॥ ਕਰਿ ਕਰਿ ਵੇਖੈ ਕਰੇ ਕਰਾਏ ਸਰਬ 
      ਜੀਆ ਨੋ ਰਿਜਕੁ ਦੀਆ ॥੧॥੬॥ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਤੀ ਮ: ੩ 

      ਪੀਤ ਬਸਨ ਕੁੰਦ-ਦਸਨ ਪ੍ਰਿਅ ਸਹਿਤ ਕੰਠ ਮਾਲ ਮੁਕਟੁ ਸੀਸਿ ਮੋਰ ਪੰਖ ਚਾਰਿ ਜੀਉ ॥ ਬੇਵਜੀਰ ਬਡੇ ਧੀਰ 
      ਧਰਮ ਅੰਗ ਅਲਖ ਅਗਮ ਖੇਲੁ ਕੀਆ ਆਪਣੈ ਉਛਾਹਿ ਜੀਉ ॥੩॥੮॥ ਸਵਈਏ ਮਹਲੇ ਚੌਥੇ ਕੇ, 
      ਗਯੰਦ 

      ਕੀਆ ਖੇਲੁ ਬਡਮੇਲੁ ਤਮਾਸਾ ॥ ਵਾਹਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਤੇਰੀ ਸਭ ਰਚਨਾ ॥ ਤੂ ਜਲਿ ਥਲਿ ਗਗਨਿ ਪਯਾਲਿ ਪੂਰਿ ਰਹਾ 
      ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਤੇ ਮੀਠੇ ਜਾ ਕੇ ਬਚਨਾ ॥੩॥੧੩॥੪੨॥ ਸਵਈਏ ਮਹਲੇ ਚੌਥੇ ਕੇ, ਗਯੰਦ 

      ਸੋ, 
      ਖੇਲੁ ਦਾ ਅਰਥ ਹੈ ਜਗਤ-ਰੂਪ ਤਮਾਸ਼ਾ  In the end, he defines "khel" as the world drama. Note: In the pre-creation state, there was no sin, nor charity. From Sukhmani Sahib: ਜਬ ਅਕਾਰੁ ਇਹੁ ਕਛੁ ਨ ਦ੍ਰਿਸਟੇਤਾ ॥ When this world had not yet appeared in any form, ਪਾਪ ਪੁੰਨ ਤਬ ਕਹ ਤੇ ਹੋਤਾ ॥ Who then committed sins and performed good deeds? ਜਬ ਧਾਰੀ ਆਪਨ ਸੁੰਨ ਸਮਾਧਿ ॥ When the Lord Himself was in Profound Samaadhi, ਤਬ ਬੈਰ ਬਿਰੋਧ ਕਿਸੁ ਸੰਗਿ ਕਮਾਤਿ ॥ Then against whom were hate and jealousy directed?   There are many lines that could be quoted, but this sums things up nicely (21st astpadi of Sukhmani): ਸਲੋਕੁ ॥ Shalok: ਸਰਗੁਨ ਨਿਰਗੁਨ ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਸੁੰਨ ਸਮਾਧੀ ਆਪਿ ॥ He possesses all qualities; He transcends all qualities; He is the Formless Lord. He Himself is in Primal Samaadhi. ਆਪਨ ਕੀਆ ਨਾਨਕਾ ਆਪੇ ਹੀ ਫਿਰਿ ਜਾਪਿ ॥੧॥ Through His Creation, O Nanak, He meditates on Himself. ||1||   And so, the command for us, too, is to meditate on God. And that's how your "friend's" questions will be answered, if he's sincere.
    • I wound up in your irc before finding this place. It was just empty at the time. 
    • i agree. Try to find the intentions of your friend. Maybe he's curious, I have doubts however. 
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