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SIKH WOMEN GATHER AT MAI BHAGO RETREAT


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33 minutes ago, HarkiranKaur said:

You are forgetting some prominent Sikh women who took Amrit in 1699. Not to mention the spy to the Mughal emperor who was present wrote in his book (in Persian) that many thousands of men AND women took baptism by the sword that day. As a Mughal he had NO personal reason to specify women. There is another translation of Chaupa singh rhetnama that says anyone who does NOT give Amrit to women.... so two different translations. Also what do you think about Chaupa Singh's comments that women are the embodiment of deceit??? That you aren't to trust even your own wife??? Chaupa singh was known Brahmin background and realistically every Rehetnama has been adulterated. 

That is borderline disrespectful. Bhai Chaupa Singh was a friend of Guru Gobind Singh Ji, he had his Darshan and his blessing, his background is irrelevant since once he took amrit ALL links to his past were destroyed. He had Darshan of Dasam Pita. what do you and your husband have that's even remotely as valuable as that.

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29 minutes ago, HarkiranKaur said:

You are forgetting some prominent Sikh women who took Amrit in 1699. Not to mention the spy to the Mughal emperor who was present wrote in his book (in Persian) that many thousands of men AND women took baptism by the sword that day. As a Mughal he had NO personal reason to specify women. There is another translation of Chaupa singh rhetnama that says anyone who does NOT give Amrit to women.... so two different translations. Also what do you think about Chaupa Singh's comments that women are the embodiment of deceit??? That you aren't to trust even your own wife??? Chaupa singh was known Brahmin background and realistically every Rehetnama has been adulterated. 

I'm not forgetting anything... your spreading complete lies... please provide names of these women who took khande Di pahul in 1699 & also provide reference to the spy who wrote in his book that women took amrit that day. Bhai Chaupa Singh (Shaheed) was the the nephew of Shaheed Bhai mati das Ji (also a Brahmin)... so you can try to malign Bhai Sahibs rehitname as much as you like just because he was from a Brahmin background but it won't work here... and if you want to play that game then what is your background??

originals of Bhai Chaupa singhs jis rehitnama are available... there's a reason puratan unadultered places like Hazur Sahib & Buddha Dal don't give women Khanda da amrit. 

You keep on about Akal Takhat maryada but please tell me the last time a woman was even allowed to perform kirtan inside Harimandir Sahib? 

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7 minutes ago, Kira said:

You're the reason why Feminazis are rising. Not a single Mahapurkh in the past century refused to give Khanda Di Pahul to woman, I guess all of them have been disobeying Guru Sahib. The name argument that Dasam Nindaks use to discredit Dasam Pita's Bani is now being applied to the Mother of the Khalsa...oh the irony.

It's funny that places such as Hazur Sahib & Buddha Dal.. who don't give women Khande Di Pahul & call Mata Ji 'Mata Sahib Deva' & don't believe she took amrit & became a Kaur are the most ardent & devoted followers of Dasam Pitas Granth & to this day have Prakash of Dasam Granth...

No mahapurekh from Hazur Sahib (where the jathedar has daily darshan of Dasam pita) or Buddha Dal has given women Khanda da amrit ever.. let alone the last 100 years

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16 minutes ago, Mahakaal96 said:

It's funny that places such as Hazur Sahib & Buddha Dal.. who don't give women Khande Di Pahul & call Mata Ji 'Mata Sahib Deva' & don't believe she took amrit & became a Kaur are the most ardent & devoted followers of Dasam Pitas Granth & to this day have Prakash of Dasam Granth...

No mahapurekh from Hazur Sahib (where the jathedar has daily darshan of Dasam pita) or Buddha Dal has given women Khanda da amrit ever.. let alone the last 100 years

The same Jathedars are most likely chamchi or Badal. Yawn Yawn, all I hear is someone who has no proof and all you've done is posted stuff that you want to believe. Put the real Gurmukh text here, handwritten and then we can discuss this.

 

I had a nice laugh at the bolded. Because someone says they had darshan of Dasam Pita suddenly they do...the same people  sacrifice goats for blood, please let me know how that goes.

 

Damdami Taksal give Amrit to woman...just about everyone does except one..so I guess that one is right. You're nothing more than a woman hater my friend. All you do is give Feminazis more and more ammo to attack Sikhi...please keep it up. 

 

 

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19 minutes ago, HarkiranKaur said:

Actually I never said it wasn't important. I have always said that family life and domestic work has been important for BOTH Mother AND Father. In other words if one is cooking why can't the other do the dishes or take turns cooking?? If one is doing he laundry why can't the other run the vacuum around? Why can't both change nappies and do feedings of babies? It creates strong bond with BOTH parents that way! That way BOTH mother and father can also make a difference outside in the world. You are actually denying men the right to bond with their children. You keep saying it's only Mothers who foster these things in their children and you put such importance on it then why not support the men who want to be part of that and equally raise their children??? It's like you are claiming that as being only for women and meanwhile you are stepping on the men who actually want to equally be part of their own family and children's lives!!! We do not have kids but if we did my husband is the one who naturally nurtures children. I am awkward around them. Should he be kept from caring for his infant child while I am forced to do all the things I feel awkward about?

and yes I recognize Kaur's have made strides everywhere and that's what I want to highlight! Society isn't being destructed because Kaur's want to make a difference outside the kitchen! There is a turbaned female pilot in the US, a turbaned female police officer in Australia. Turbaned Sikh women who have made strides in science, law, medicine... you think they should have stayed at home instead chained to the kitchen?? 

My contribution was small. I fought the Canadian military to allow Kaur's to tie dastaar in uniform and won. Males already could. It came down to the same stereotypes that many Singh's think women should not tie turbans. That it's not 'feminine' enough for them. On doing so I was ostracized by nearly all of the royal canadian navy (goras) who rolled their eyes, said some of the most nasty things I have  ever heard and I don't care because now in future Kaur's can join the military without conpromising their identity. What I am insyerested In seeing is Singh's stopping to see Kaur's as just domestic help, simple minded and incapable and wanting us to be submissive and obedient to them like they own us. I want to see Singh's stopping to think they have every right to tell us Kaur's what we can and can not do like they think they as a gender have authority over us. If the shoe was on the other foot they'd certainly think differently!!!

So in summary you are the one who is denying Singh's their rights as fathers and husbands to have equal rights to contribute to the family and domestic life. The most successful families I know they share domestic duties and they both work. That way both parents can follow their dreams and both can bond with their children. 

Please watch this video as it explains the frustration many Kaur's feel at how Singhs treat them:

http://kaur.sikhnet.com/

I have lived long  enough to know how fatherhood is nurtured or neutered by the mother too , Why should I expect the guy who is the breadwinner  (because I chose with him to stay at home and look after my twin sons and toddler myself rather than palming off my responsibilities to a stranger )  to come home and do my share of the work too ,  when I'd rather he'd play/talk spend time with the children ?

I was taught by my mother( the product of generations of wise Gursikh women) that ALL family relationships can be enabled or disabled by a woman's attitude , I agree we have immense power and immense responsibility as primary carers (if you have an argument with that , take it up with Akal Purakh) . I'd rather have volunteered help than lay down 'laws' to browbeat someone to feel cornered into doing something and generally if people are treated like responsible adults they do volunteer, even rush to help. They can never be equally involved by virtue of their outside work taking up time but they can have an important and pivotal role in our children's lives.

Most people have singletons , I had a set of twins two years after my first and so yes I relied on his help from time to time but not as a lock-in because he too had to get up early and go outside to work , I didn't have the luxury of time or choices to do it  to some externally idealised standard ,but I did it anyhow and they(the boys) still have an excellent bond with both of us even now they are on the threshold of their adulthood. What's more they are not averse to doing work in the home , they look after their kid sister and they take that caring responsible nature outside into the world . 

 

The Navy has a well established misogynistic reputation  so it doesn't surprise me .

that cartoon is racist , full of BS stereotypes , my Mum and Dad pushed me to be the best at what ever I did in school, my Dad was an Engineering grad and took interest in my exposure to sciences and do well in Mathematics . Truth of Mai Bhago was her father trained both her and her brothers it wasn't a compensation step. Some mistakes in the story as well ...

What was this based on 1970s attitudes ?

 

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6 minutes ago, HarkiranKaur said:

His background would still have some aspect in his thoughts. Meaning Brahmin background would still influence his thoughts. Even today some siks can't shake Hindu influence! 

Maybe if you knew the part I was referring to.... 

IMG_0735.thumb.PNG.350f2e5a55ccbb3ab86dcf18b60e9bb3.PNG

So you believe women should never be trusted even a man's own wife such that all of us women should be seen as the very 'embodiment of deceit'???? How about seeing us as impure that no Singh should eat anything left by us?? Do you really think this is how your Guru thought of you??? Still think it's borderline disrespect? How about  e disrespect to females for saying such things??

 

Post the actual handwritten Gurmukhi on here you muppet. He was a Singh of Guru Gobind Singh Ji, He had his caste destroyed. what vile thoughts you have that someone who lived with Guru Gobind Singh Ji and fought with him had aspects of Hindumat on him. Your logic is so sound, I guess Guru Amar Das Ji (while he was Bhai Amar Das Ji) had his hindumat influence on him. So please. 

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Just now, HarkiranKaur said:

Written in pen no. Written in Gurmukhi yes. Ahh I see where u r going suggestng this has been adultered and I agreed further up saying that none of the rehetnamas can be claimed to be original. This is the same argument used to say we should not have Amrit. 

Then stop insulting a Gurmukh, you can't even find the historical documentation to prove he had bias but you called him biased. What an narrow minded little muppet you are.

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52 minutes ago, Kira said:

The same Jathedars are most likely chamchi or Badal. Yawn Yawn, all I hear is someone who has no proof and all you've done is posted stuff that you want to believe. Put the real Gurmukh text here, handwritten and then we can discuss this.

 

I had a nice laugh at the bolded. Because someone says they had darshan of Dasam Pita suddenly they do...the same people  sacrifice goats for blood, please let me know how that goes.

 

Damdami Taksal give Amrit to woman...just about everyone does except one..so I guess that one is right. You're nothing more than a woman hater my friend. All you do is give Feminazis more and more ammo to attack Sikhi...please keep it up. 

 

 

I think your mistaken... all the chumche are in Panjab... not Nanded.

Sant Gurbachan Singh Bhindranwale... the treasure chest of knowledge & the jewel amongst scholars says in Sri Sukhmani Sahib Katha that if a woman recites Sukhmani Sahib with the desire to be reborn as a male then her wish will be fulfilled... wonder why Sant Ji said that??!

Originals of Bhai Chaupa Singh rehitnama are available at Hazur Sahib & also Panjab University have a copy I believe.

Someone chooses to follow maryada of Hazur Sahib/Budha Dal & adhere to rehitname written by people of the stature of Bhai Chaupa Singh automatically become woman haters... lol.... what's next... I'm RSS??

There's also written proof where naamdharis claim to be the first to give women khanda da amrit... these articles are from around 1850.

Its not a matter of what I WANT to beilieve but rather a case of wanting to believe in that which Mahraj gave us as maryada & not man made maryada that was created whilst our country was under the control of foreigners.

What I do have is pictures of handwritten rehitname by Mata Sahib Deva Ji... IF mata had taken amrit then why didn't she use Kaur in her name instead of Devi??!

IMG_1960.JPG.825d8840e71983f3247c5c45c02f68c6.JPGIMG_1959.JPG.018bcdc46118b863df9e91724e413a8e.JPGIMG_1958.JPG.184f50062764c01e31f4fc6bdd79ae19.JPG

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