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does sikhi permit use of contraception with own wife

53 posts in this topic

43 minutes ago, Preeet said:

Exactly, it makes me kinda confused on how in some Gurbani lines it talks about sadhus leaving their wives but then they still keep thinking of women in their mind as a sadhu.. Can the same thing be said for gay people who try to 'leave' the marriage concept while becoming celibate & 'dharmic', but still think of guys? So does that not mean that they should get married as well.... bhul chuk maff kijye

which gurbani lines you referring to ? please post. 

Also I don't think anywhere any of bhagat, guru ji or bhatts baanis refer to women in any sexual way at all ! 

It is just example to help us understand jeev-aatma (often referred to as 'jeev-istree' in sikh literature) relationship with param-aatma (god) . 

Since we have no inkling of what relationship to god feels like , those who have felt it have tried to pen it in comparison to earthly relationships we do understand ! and what more intimate relation than that of a spouse ! 

In Gurbani , at places, baani sometimes go along the lines of "Dear sister, tell me how you impressed your husband ? ... he doesn't like me, but likes you, tell me how you impressed ...." something along these lines ! and final closing line is of joy of how the wife finally impresses her husband and the typical shabad would close so ".. and then he came to bed and finally I enjoyed him ... " .. 

I think I have read atleast one such shabad although I don't remember which exactly. but trust me, there's no sexual undercurrent in this shabad AT ALL ! it just helps us relate to our bodiless relationship with creator (something we don't understand) by comparing it to a relationship of intimacy that we do understand and often live ! 

Same can be said of krishna and gopis in hindu literature. Some say krishna had 16500 wives. Its not possible literally ! so again a hidden metaphor . Gopis revolving around krishna in play dance. Trust me, this often gets sexualized, but subtle metaphor is lost, namely that of souls (gopis) enjoying the spiritual bliss of krishna (god) and all of creation revolving around the creator.

Rigveda and some upanishads mention the relationship of soul (jeev) and parbrahm as such : 

"On a tree bearing multiple fruits, both bitter and sweet, sits two birds of a kind, eternal companions.

One , of golden plume and luminous sits serenly on topmost branch, unperturbed and in bliss.

On the lower branches, jumping from branch to branch, is its companion, who sometimes eat sweet fruits and sometimes bitter. 

When it eats bitter fruits, it sometimes looks up and see its undisturbed , blissed companion of golden feathers. However , it soons forget its sorrows and starts eating sweet and bitter again . 

Sometimes, again it eats bitter and this time flies on top branch , approaches the golden plume companion and when it goes very near, it realizes its golden plume is itself only, its inner-most self, the atma !"

 

 the tree refers to body or world, the golden plume companion is the real self, the bird moving from here and there is jeev . the bitter and sweet fruits are dukh and sukh respectively which we bear in this world. When the bird goes on top branch (higher avastha) , it realizes its own self, and attains liberation and bliss, which gurbaani refers to as "mann tu jot saroop hai, apna mool pachaan" 

Quite good example these seers made ! many such metaphors throughout in gurbani also. 

The bigger question is "Can we believe ? truly?"

Edited by AjeetSinghPunjabi
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9 hours ago, Akalifauj said:

Can you bring a reference to what sang means in Gurmat terms.  Literal meaning of sang is company, yet in english you mistranslate to say love.  If you were trying to adapt the union of one owns woman with thee man to the other side of the coin of never going to another woman's bed even in dreams.  This would mean to translate sang as lust in english because going to another woman's bed in dreams is all about lust and the later is being prescribed by the Guru according to your beliefs.  But obvoiusly we have Sri Guru Tegh Bahadur Sahib jis bani to shine more light on this teaching.  Satguru says not to lust and attach yourself to family, including wife.  So it can't be lust and it also can't be love because love is attachment when speaking about wife. Gurbani read as lavan as man and wife get married says nothing about loving your wife as you have so carelessly put it.  Worldly love is not approved in Gurbani.  Instead the lavan describe the journey the soul takes on the path to the Guru.  First lav says to let go of the vedas the praise to brahma.  Gurbani says the vedas are stuck in the 3 gunas and dont know the fourth state.  The 3 gunas are maya and this includes lust love and attachment.  Contemplating over the lavan a person can easily understand the meaning of "sang" in the wisdom sri guru tegh bahadur sahib ji passed on to sri guru gobind singh ji at a young age. 

The verse from Dasam Granth is obviously talking about physical relationship between male n female, husband n wife therefore are valid.

Non-marital sex is forbidden, even to fantasies is not allowed.

If you read today's Hukamnama from Sri Darbar Sahib Amritsar it will remove all doubt's about Grehasti not being Spiritual. More so Sikhs should be Udaasi within Grehast Jeevan.

https://www.sikhnet.com/hukam

Edited by singhbj singh
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1 hour ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

which gurbani lines you referring to ? please post. 

Also I don't think anywhere any of bhagat, guru ji or bhatts baanis refer to women in any sexual way at all ! 

It is just example to help us understand jeev-aatma (often referred to as 'jeev-istree' in sikh literature) relationship with param-aatma (god) . 

Since we have no inkling of what relationship to god feels like , those who have felt it have tried to pen it in comparison to earthly relationships we do understand ! and what more intimate relation than that of a spouse ! 

In Gurbani , at places, baani sometimes go along the lines of "Dear sister, tell me how you impressed your husband ? ... he doesn't like me, but likes you, tell me how you impressed ...." something along these lines ! and final closing line is of joy of how the wife finally impresses her husband and the typical shabad would close so ".. and then he came to bed and finally I enjoyed him ... " .. 

I think I have read atleast one such shabad although I don't remember which exactly. but trust me, there's no sexual undercurrent in this shabad AT ALL ! it just helps us relate to our bodiless relationship with creator (something we don't understand) by comparing it to a relationship of intimacy that we do understand and often live ! 

Same can be said of krishna and gopis in hindu literature. Some say krishna had 16500 wives. Its not possible literally ! so again a hidden metaphor . Gopis revolving around krishna in play dance. Trust me, this often gets sexualized, but subtle metaphor is lost, namely that of souls (gopis) enjoying the spiritual bliss of krishna (god) and all of creation revolving around the creator.

Rigveda and some upanishads mention the relationship of soul (jeev) and parbrahm as such : 

"On a tree bearing multiple fruits, both bitter and sweet, sits two birds of a kind, eternal companions.

One , of golden plume and luminous sits serenly on topmost branch, unperturbed and in bliss.

On the lower branches, jumping from branch to branch, is its companion, who sometimes eat sweet fruits and sometimes bitter. 

When it eats bitter fruits, it sometimes looks up and see its undisturbed , blissed companion of golden feathers. However , it soons forget its sorrows and starts eating sweet and bitter again . 

Sometimes, again it eats bitter and this time flies on top branch , approaches the golden plume companion and when it goes very near, it realizes its golden plume is itself only, its inner-most self, the atma !"

 

 the tree refers to body or world, the golden plume companion is the real self, the bird moving from here and there is jeev . the bitter and sweet fruits are dukh and sukh respectively which we bear in this world. When the bird goes on top branch (higher avastha) , it realizes its own self, and attains liberation and bliss, which gurbaani refers to as "mann tu jot saroop hai, apna mool pachaan" 

Quite good example these seers made ! many such metaphors throughout in gurbani also. 

The bigger question is "Can we believe ? truly?"

ਹਾਥ ਕਮੰਡਲ੝ ਕਾਪੜੀਆ ਮਨਿ ਤ੝ਰਿਸਨਾ ਉਪਜੀ ਭਾਰੀ ॥
Hĝth kamandal kĝpṛī­ĝ man ṯarisnĝ upjī bẖĝrī.
With bowl in hand, wearing his patched coat, great desires well up in his mind.
ਇਸਤ੝ਰੀ ਤਜਿ ਕਰਿ ਕਾਮਿ ਵਿਆਪਿਆ ਚਿਤ੝ ਲਾਇਆ ਪਰ ਨਾਰੀ ॥
Isṯarī ṯaj kar kĝm vi­ĝpi­ĝ cẖiṯ lĝ­i­ĝ par nĝrī.
Abandoning his own wife, he is engrossed in sexual desire; his thoughts are on the wives of others.
 

& about the 16K wives of that avatar, it is real.. The story is that there was an asura named NarakhAsur and he kidnapped those 16000 women, Sri Krishna ji saved those women and the women said something along the lines that who would marry them now considering that they have been captive at an asura's home. So Sri Krishna ji told them that he will be their spouses name wise.

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2 minutes ago, Preeet said:

ਹਾਥ ਕਮੰਡਲ੝ ਕਾਪੜੀਆ ਮਨਿ ਤ੝ਰਿਸਨਾ ਉਪਜੀ ਭਾਰੀ ॥
Hĝth kamandal kĝpṛī­ĝ man ṯarisnĝ upjī bẖĝrī.
With bowl in hand, wearing his patched coat, great desires well up in his mind.
ਇਸਤ੝ਰੀ ਤਜਿ ਕਰਿ ਕਾਮਿ ਵਿਆਪਿਆ ਚਿਤ੝ ਲਾਇਆ ਪਰ ਨਾਰੀ ॥
Isṯarī ṯaj kar kĝm vi­ĝpi­ĝ cẖiṯ lĝ­i­ĝ par nĝrī.
Abandoning his own wife, he is engrossed in sexual desire; his thoughts are on the wives of others.
 

& about the 16K wives of that avatar, it is real.. The story is that there was an asura named NarakhAsur and he kidnapped those 16000 women, Sri Krishna ji saved those women and the women said something along the lines that who would marry them now considering that they have been captive at an asura's home. So Sri Krishna ji told them that he will be their spouses name wise.

The gurbani line you quoted describe signs of a fake saadhu ! 

In case of a gay man, it would be someone who claims to be a monk now but even within monasteries, homosexual activity is happening.

Its a lesson don't go celibacy just because of your life circumcstances lol

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9 hours ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

The gurbani line you quoted describe signs of a fake saadhu ! 

In case of a gay man, it would be someone who claims to be a monk now but even within monasteries, homosexual activity is happening.

Its a lesson don't go celibacy just because of your life circumcstances lol

Lol what difference is it between a new sadhu, and someone who is gay who is forced to be 'celibate' in sikhi..(instead of fulfilling the kaam(marriage) part of life [Dharma, Artha , Kama and Mukhti])? Don't both of those unmarried people have their minds distracted at times

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14 hours ago, Preeet said:

Lol what difference is it between a new sadhu, and someone who is gay who is forced to be 'celibate' in sikhi..(instead of fulfilling the kaam(marriage) part of life [Dharma, Artha , Kama and Mukhti])? Don't both of those unmarried people have their minds distracted at times

the 'chaar padarth' u mentioned are part of hindu dharam. Nowhere mentioned in sikhi as far as I am aware , certainly not the artha (finance) and kama(sexual desire). 

Secondly, I am wondering what if I chose middle way : like having it with other guys , and also maintaining a dharmic life (sewa, simran, etc ) ?

where would i land then ? because the longest I have gone without touching myself was 42 days ! trust me, my mind was going havoc with all of it ! you can constrain urself physically but mentally mind still wavers. Heck , it happens in gurudwara if a hot guy passed by you . Very tough indeed !

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3 hours ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

the 'chaar padarth' u mentioned are part of hindu dharam. Nowhere mentioned in sikhi as far as I am aware , certainly not the artha (finance) and kama(sexual desire). 

Secondly, I am wondering what if I chose middle way : like having it with other guys , and also maintaining a dharmic life (sewa, simran, etc ) ?

where would i land then ? because the longest I have gone without touching myself was 42 days ! trust me, my mind was going havoc with all of it ! you can constrain urself physically but mentally mind still wavers. Heck , it happens in gurudwara if a hot guy passed by you . Very tough indeed !

You should read nitnem sahib (daily).. It mentions the char padaraths in it. Kaam generally means wish (manokaamna).. Aartha is also blessed on Sikhs if they give dasvand, then their income also increases. As for the last issue, I sadly do not know what to advise you to do. Probably just marry another guy through court marriage and then both be blessed with amrit together? Since I think couples from different background religions who convert to sikhi do not get an anand karaj if they are new to sikhi now, since they are already married. Not sure though, just my opinion. 

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On 24/02/2017 at 11:13 PM, singhbj singh said:

The verse from Dasam Granth is obviously talking about physical relationship between male n female, husband n wife therefore are valid.

Non-marital sex is forbidden, even to fantasies is not allowed.

If you read today's Hukamnama from Sri Darbar Sahib Amritsar it will remove all doubt's about Grehasti not being Spiritual. More so Sikhs should be Udaasi within Grehast Jeevan.

https://www.sikhnet.com/hukam

The Gurus never stopped from speaking directly.  If Satguru was saying to increase physical relations he would have directly said it.  But he didn't and said increase "sang".  Your mind is polluted by sex and you want gurmat to give you a thumbs up but this will never happen.  Satguru in the later part of the lesson gives an example of what not to do ever; go to another woman bed in your dreams.  What does this mean.  It means thoughts are dangerous and theu take you the pit of hell if this is how you think.  Your backward western culture has taken your mind 10000 steps back.  

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13 hours ago, Preeet said:

You should read nitnem sahib (daily).. It mentions the char padaraths in it. Kaam generally means wish (manokaamna).. Aartha is also blessed on Sikhs if they give dasvand, then their income also increases. As for the last issue, I sadly do not know what to advise you to do. Probably just marry another guy through court marriage and then both be blessed with amrit together? Since I think couples from different background religions who convert to sikhi do not get an anand karaj if they are new to sikhi now, since they are already married. Not sure though, just my opinion. 

If non-sikhs become sikhs then have amrit they have to be remarried according to anand karaj to be correct in Sikhi

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1 hour ago, jkvlondon said:

If non-sikhs become sikhs then have amrit they have to be remarried according to anand karaj to be correct in Sikhi

Really..? Some of my family has been married through hindu style and never got remarried like that.. lol.

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11 minutes ago, Preeet said:

Really..? Some of my family has been married through hindu style and never got remarried like that.. lol.

Your family does not set the precedent.

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50 minutes ago, Akalifauj said:

Your family does not set the precedent.

What would the 5pyare tell a gay married couple if they were to get blessed with amrit together then? To get an anand karaj?

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21 minutes ago, Preeet said:

What would the 5pyare tell a gay married couple if they were to get blessed with amrit together then? To get an anand karaj?

Are you comparing your family hindu wedding to the illegitimate couple of homosexuals?  On one hand you want your family actions to be the benchmark and in the next few hours you want to compare them to homosexuals couples.  Let me remind you, sex outside of marriage is a kurehit and this would mean no such thing as homosexual amritdharis actively living as homosexuals.  Also no such thing as homosexual amritdharis as couples because homosexuals can't get married in Sikhi by Anand Karaj and any other marriage ceremony is not a replacement to make them a legitimate couple according to Sikhi.  I know this is a lot for you to digest, but take your time and don't be rash in your response.  You will only make Trump look wittier than you.

Edited by Akalifauj

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4 hours ago, Akalifauj said:

The Gurus never stopped from speaking directly.  If Satguru was saying to increase physical relations he would have directly said it.  But he didn't and said increase "sang".  Your mind is polluted by sex and you want gurmat to give you a thumbs up but this will never happen.  Satguru in the later part of the lesson gives an example of what not to do ever; go to another woman bed in your dreams.  What does this mean.  It means thoughts are dangerous and theu take you the pit of hell if this is how you think.  Your backward western culture has taken your mind 10000 steps back.  

Gurbani is an ocean nobody can follow all of it.

It took many Mahapurakhs from various backgrounds n lifestyle to experience, practice & compose Gurbani.

One can choose to be Bairaagi but only through Waheguru jeeo's will you can do so not by self effort.

Most end up being Abhaagi, neither Grehasti nor Bairaagi.

For Paapi's like me Guru Arjan Dev ji gives hope -

"Says Nanak, hear my prayer, God;

I am silly, stubborn and filled with sexual desire - please, liberate me! ||4||"

Source - http://beta.igurbani.com/shabad/2813

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41 minutes ago, Akalifauj said:

Are you comparing your family hindu wedding to the illegitimate couple of homosexuals?  On one hand you want your family actions to be the benchmark and in the next few hours you want to compare them to homosexuals couples.  Let me remind you, sex outside of marriage is a kurehit and this would mean no such thing as homosexual amritdharis actively living as homosexuals.  Also no such thing as homosexual amritdharis as couples because homosexuals can't get married in Sikhi by Anand Karaj and any other marriage ceremony is not a replacement to make them a legitimate couple according to Sikhi.  I know this is a lot for you to digest, but take your time and don't be rash in your response.  You will only make Trump look wittier than you.

Im not comparing a hindu wedding with anything when I was talking about a gay married couple.. Im not even trying to be witty, just wanted to know your opinion on that question.. But just so you know, there are married gay couples, and I just wanted to know what youd think the 5pyare would tell them if they wanted to convert to sikhism.

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6 hours ago, Preeet said:

Really..? Some of my family has been married through hindu style and never got remarried like that.. lol.

that's right , they also have name karan ceremony too ...  maybe your family never revealed that fact  but think about it to be married in anand Karaj  is very different from the Hindu ceremony one binds you equally  to Akal Purakh as your Husband lord the other diminishes the woman to daasi of her human pati , never afforded her own right to salvation oly told that she has to serve her husband in this life (and I guess the other six janams) before being born as a man to get chance at mukhti.

Totally different scenarios

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3 hours ago, jkvlondon said:

that's right , they also have name karan ceremony too ...  maybe your family never revealed that fact  but think about it to be married in anand Karaj  is very different from the Hindu ceremony one binds you equally  to Akal Purakh as your Husband lord the other diminishes the woman to daasi of her human pati , never afforded her own right to salvation oly told that she has to serve her husband in this life (and I guess the other six janams) before being born as a man to get chance at mukhti.

Totally different scenarios

Makes sense! I understood about the naming ceremony is given to new people too, but I havent heard about anand karaj being needed as well to the already married. Im probably never going to marry anyone though.

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On ‎26‎/‎02‎/‎2017 at 9:53 PM, singhbj singh said:

Gurbani is an ocean nobody can follow all of it.

It took many Mahapurakhs from various backgrounds n lifestyle to experience, practice & compose Gurbani.

We are not talking about individuals.  This is a talk on what Gurmat says to do.  Whenever your fanatical liberal agenda is shown in it's true light, you attempt to change the topic.  Stick to the topic we were discussing for once.

Quote

One can choose to be Bairaagi but only through Waheguru jeeo's will you can do so not by self effort.

Most end up being Abhaagi, neither Grehasti nor Bairaagi.

You are diluting the terms to fit your lifestyle as the standard of Gurmat.  Grehasti jeevan does not tell a person to increase love with the wife, but sang (company) as Sri Guru Tegh Badadur Sahib ji said to Gobind Rai at a young age. 
 

Quote

 

For Paapi's like me Guru Arjan Dev ji gives hope -

"Says Nanak, hear my prayer, God;

I am silly, stubborn and filled with sexual desire - please, liberate me! ||4||"

Source - http://beta.igurbani.com/shabad/2813

 

What does liberation mean?  Liberation is achieved by following the Guru's path, which includes removing sexual desires between husband and wife.  A person who is indulging in sexual desire can't be liberated.  Anand Karaj is not a licence to go to town on the spouse.  Liberation means to take the shackles off of attachment between husband and wife.  Husband and wife are worldly relations as Sri Guru Tegh Bahadur Sahib ji says.  A husband and wife who follow the teachings of the Guru are in a true relationship because they are following the Guru.  This type of husband and wife left behind the teachings of vedas, which are lost in the 3 gunas.   

If you were truly following Sri Guru Arjan Dev ji, you would ask Sri Guru Arjan Dev ji how do I remove my silliness, stubbornness and sexual desire: 

gun gwvq Acuq AibnwsI kwm k®oD ibnsy md FITy ]

Singing the Glorious Praises of the imperishable, indestructible Lord, sexual desire, anger and stubborn pride vanish.

 
There is your answer.  If a addict never admits he has a problem, then how would he get rid of something that doesn't exist in his mind?
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According to Gurbani, anybody can attain liberation whether Grehasti or Bairaagi.

Being Grehasti obviously means people can, had & are having sex !

Adharam is extra marital sex.

If one takes path of a Bairaagi then he should remain detached.

Now most wannabes remain engrossed in Moh & Maya, making them Abhaagis or namesake Bairaagis.

Ang 550 Line 15 Raag Bihaagrhaa: Guru Amar Das
 

ਦਰਵੇਸੀ ਕੋ ਜਾਣਸੀ ਵਿਰਲਾ ਕੋ ਦਰਵੇਸੁ ॥

Dharavaesee Ko Jaanasee Viralaa Ko Dharavaes ||

दरवेसी को जाणसी विरला को दरवेसु ॥

How rare is the dervish, the Saintly renunciate, who understands renunciation.

 

ਜੇ ਘਰਿ ਘਰਿ ਹੰਢੈ ਮੰਗਦਾ ਧਿਗੁ ਜੀਵਣੁ ਧਿਗੁ ਵੇਸੁ ॥

Jae Ghar Ghar Handtai Mangadhaa Dhhig Jeevan Dhhig Vaes ||

जे घरि घरि हंढै मंगदा धिगु जीवणु धिगु वेसु ॥

Cursed is the life, and cursed are the clothes, of one who wanders around, begging from door to door.

15 ਬਿਹਾਗੜੇ ਕੀ ਵਾਰ: (ਮ: ੩) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੫੫੦ ਪੰ. ੧੫ 
Raag Bihaagrhaa Guru Amar Das 

 

There is no shame in accepting Grehasti Jeevan, Baba Baljit Singh Daduwal did it by marrying late.

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On 2017-03-06 at 1:40 AM, Akalifauj said:

We are not talking about individuals.  This is a talk on what Gurmat says to do.  Whenever your fanatical liberal agenda is shown in it's true light, you attempt to change the topic.  Stick to the topic we were discussing for once.

You are diluting the terms to fit your lifestyle as the standard of Gurmat.  Grehasti jeevan does not tell a person to increase love with the wife, but sang (company) as Sri Guru Tegh Badadur Sahib ji said to Gobind Rai at a young age. 
 

What does liberation mean?  Liberation is achieved by following the Guru's path, which includes removing sexual desires between husband and wife.  A person who is indulging in sexual desire can't be liberated.  Anand Karaj is not a licence to go to town on the spouse.  Liberation means to take the shackles off of attachment between husband and wife.  Husband and wife are worldly relations as Sri Guru Tegh Bahadur Sahib ji says.  A husband and wife who follow the teachings of the Guru are in a true relationship because they are following the Guru.  This type of husband and wife left behind the teachings of vedas, which are lost in the 3 gunas.   

If you were truly following Sri Guru Arjan Dev ji, you would ask Sri Guru Arjan Dev ji how do I remove my silliness, stubbornness and sexual desire: 

gun gwvq Acuq AibnwsI kwm k®oD ibnsy md FITy ]

Singing the Glorious Praises of the imperishable, indestructible Lord, sexual desire, anger and stubborn pride vanish.

 
There is your answer.  If a addict never admits he has a problem, then how would he get rid of something that doesn't exist in his mind?

If a married couple are living as brother / sister then why even be married at all!? There is no point to marriage at all! Did our Gurus promote life of ascetic now???

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People really miss the point, don't they? 

Ok adultery is bad, extra marital is haraam. But what if a person never had a chance to get married? 

What is extra marital for him? Its a cruel joke for him. First you deny him right to marry, and acceptance in society, then you say if he ever had sex, its sinful . 

 

If homosexuals are supposed to be celibate because their sex doesn't lead to reproduction, then it beggers the belief how is sex with contraceptives in heterosexual couples any different than gay sex? Both lead to same end point : no reproduction! 

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37 minutes ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

People really miss the point, don't they? 

Ok adultery is bad, extra marital is haraam. But what if a person never had a chance to get married? 

What is extra marital for him? Its a cruel joke for him. First you deny him right to marry, and acceptance in society, then you say if he ever had sex, its sinful . 

 

If homosexuals are supposed to be celibate because their sex doesn't lead to reproduction, then it beggers the belief how is sex with contraceptives in heterosexual couples any different than gay sex? Both lead to same end point : no reproduction! 

Sin aside as I won't comment... but the anus was not meant for that and can actually be injured with penetration causing perforation of the bowels. In short it's not natural. The <banned word filter activated> produces lubrication naturally to accommodate a male appendage however the anus does not that should be one clue. From a purely medical point of view anyway. Kind of like the insert tab a into slot b type of thing. Not slot c which is meant as exit only. 

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2 hours ago, HarkiranKaur said:

If a married couple are living as brother / sister then why even be married at all!? There is no point to marriage at all! Did our Gurus promote life of ascetic now???

If you would like to marry your brother, that is your choice.  Keep the topic on point. 

Thanks.

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1 hour ago, Akalifauj said:

If you would like to marry your brother, that is your choice.  Keep the topic on point. 

Thanks.

It was on topic. I wasn't saying brother / sister should be married. I said if a husband and wife should live AS if they were brother and sister (platonic) then what is the point of marriage. 

Edited by HarkiranKaur

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On 20/02/2017 at 2:47 PM, Guest Kadeykadey said:

And you should be the last one to be preaching over here!  There is no evidence of homos either during that time!  What a hypocrite. Heteros had too many kids 'cos all they had in those days was bedroom entertainment and nothing else.  Bollywood and television entertainment were not invented till recently to keep their pathetically lazy and useless minds occupied. Let's face it, how many people in those days could read or write with Punjabi blood running in their veins? They never could read newspapers, novels, medical journals or even a simple comic in those days, could they? Their unoccupied minds ran wild, created havoc at every moment of their lives.  Contraception  became extremely important to stop producing unwanted army of hooligans meaning unruly, unwanted kids!  Some kids never even went to school if they were born in a pennd. All sex is lust therefore should only be used in an emergency like when couples want to have a child to increase the size of their family. Honestly you are such a hypocrite. 

 

What is this bakwaas? Some people just don't know when to zip it

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