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Arshdeepsingh
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28 minutes ago, harsharan000 said:

Just one point, education is not essential for sikhee to exist.

It is like saying, I am a teacher,  and this is essential for being a football player, for example. One thing has nothing to do with the other.

Sikhee is complete by itself as per Gurmat, it needs no complements.

Sikhee to be fully realized needs only love, faith and regular devotion.

Sat Sree Akal.

 

Exactly

 

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Education and sikhi both need to be balanced for a successful personality. If you never learnt English. .. like my grandmum you would not be able to communicate on this website.  If you never learnt punjabi then you would not be able to read and fully understand gurbani. 

If you are not properly educated then you will not be able to earn your livelihood which is important as Guru Nanak dev ji tells us kirat karo. If you are not earning enough then can you wand chako... if you are not having any spare? 

If we are not doing any naam japna whilst getting our education then education alone does not proove to be fruitful.  

Therefore we need to balance our education with naam japna... and teach our kids the importance of both as well.  

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Although education and wealth (and status) aren't mutually exclusive, there's katha out there which discusses how Man finds himself completely entangled in the accumulation of money once he starts upon that road. Many say, "I'll be different. I'll know when to stop. I'll use my money for the betterment of my fellow man." And it never happens. Even when he or she is sleeping their soul is lost in how much must be made, or worried about not losing what they have. When you listen to something like that from a Gurmat perspective it hits you what a burden excessive wealth can be. Heck, even Charles Dickens did an admirable job of broaching a similar subject in A Christmas Carol. Definitely worth a read.

Of course, education and wealth, as I said, aren't always the best of bedfellows. Education for self betterment is one of the best things a person can do for themselves.

 

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10 hours ago, MisterrSingh said:

Although education and wealth (and status) aren't mutually exclusive, there's katha out there which discusses how Man finds himself completely entangled in the accumulation of money once he starts upon that road. Many say, "I'll be different. I'll know when to stop. I'll use my money for the betterment of my fellow man." And it never happens. Even when he or she is sleeping their soul is lost in how much must be made, or worried about not losing what they have. When you listen to something like that from a Gurmat perspective it hits you what a burden excessive wealth can be. Heck, even Charles Dickens did an admirable job of broaching a similar subject in A Christmas Carol. Definitely worth a read.

Of course, education and wealth, as I said, aren't always the best of bedfellows. Education for self betterment is one of the best things a person can do for themselves.

 

Some piercing truths there. Seen this happen with people I've grown up with.

I've got to check out A Christmas Carol soon. Been on Bleak House for a while now. 

 

George Orwell's Animal Farm is also VERY relevant to our community. It shows how an egalitarian movement becomes corrupted just like ours has been these days. 

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16 hours ago, harsharan000 said:

Just one point, education is not essential for sikhee to exist.

It is like saying, I am a teacher,  and this is essential for being a football player, for example. One thing has nothing to do with the other.

Sikhee is complete by itself as per Gurmat, it needs no complements.

Sikhee to be fully realized needs only love, faith and regular devotion.

Sat Sree Akal.

 

I understand your point on a purely spiritual plain. But from what I can see, Sikhi itself has a broad education embedded within. If we look at bani (including the Dasam Granth), we see that it does cover a broad expanse of subject matter (i.e. not just spiritual). If we also look at dasam pita's early life, we also see some serious and sustained effort being made to raise the intellectual levels of his Sikhs through literature. If we perceive this as a whole (Sikhi from our Guru Granth and Dasam Granth as well as irrefutable historical evidence), it doesn't appear as if there is a line between Sikhi as a spiritual endeavour and Sikhi as a vehicle for intellectual and social (and even societal) development. 

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14 minutes ago, dallysingh101 said:

Some piercing truths there. Seen this happen with people I've grown up with.

I've got to check out A Christmas Carol soon. Been on Bleak House for a while now. 

George Orwell's Animal Farm is also VERY relevant to our community. It shows how an egalitarian movement becomes corrupted just like ours has been these days. 

I read it for the first time a few days ago, and I must say it's surprisingly spiritual from a dharmic perspective. The many, many film and TV adaptations have failed to capture the heart of that story, instead defaulting to the standard Christian perspective (which isn't bad or inaccurate per se, but not exactly as the writer presents the story imo). Apparently, Dickens was heavily into the spiritualism movement of the Victorian era, and supposedly knew of concepts such as multiple lives, rebirth, spiritual guides, etc., so I guess that informed some of ACC. Probably the first Dickens story I've actually enjoyed. I read Oliver Twist a while ago and it was torture, lol.

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1 minute ago, MisterrSingh said:

I read it for the first time a few days ago, and I must say it's surprisingly spiritual from a dharmic perspective. The many, many film and TV adaptations have failed to capture the heart of that story, instead defaulting to the standard Christian perspective (which isn't bad or inaccurate per se, but not exactly as the writer presents the story imo). Apparently, Dickens was heavily into the spiritualism movement of the Victorian era, and supposedly knew of concepts such as multiple lives, rebirth, spiritual guides, etc., so I guess that informed some of ACC. Probably the first Dickens story I've actually enjoyed. I read Oliver Twist a while ago and it was torture, lol.

Yeah, Oliver Twist isn't his best work in my opinion, despite the characters enduring stamp on the English psyche. I too started with that when I was young and didn't read Dickens again until many decades later...

If you like that kind of stuff, try Pickwick Papers next. It's his first popular work (originally put out in installments) - it's a raw demonstration of young, developing literary genius at work.

By the way, his favourite book was David Copperfield - and I found it bloody awesome. 

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1 hour ago, dallysingh101 said:

Yeah, Oliver Twist isn't his best work in my opinion, despite the characters enduring stamp on the English psyche. I too started with that when I was young and didn't read Dickens again until many decades later...

If you like that kind of stuff, try Pickwick Papers next. It's his first popular work (originally put out in installments) - it's a raw demonstration of young, developing literary genius at work.

By the way, his favourite book was David Copperfield - and I found it bloody awesome. 

Yes! Oliver Twist put me off Dickens until I forced myself to read ACC. I don't know why Twist has gained the reputation it has. I find it to be quite embarrassingly cloying at times. That's probably the style he was going for, but still it's a bit much. Even something as apparently preachy as ACC doesn't lay it on as thick as I'd anticipated, which was a good thing.

I'll be going through those two titles you mentioned. I don't think i have them in my collection, so I may have to pick them up. I do have Great Expectations (unread), but as I said after reading Twist I was put off from reading anything from Dickens, lol. 

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On 28/12/2016 at 8:30 PM, Arshdeepsingh said:

WJKK WJKF,

 Ever since I've gotten into sikhi I have started thinking their isn't much use in education. Im not saying education is useless and everyone should not go to school. Im trying to say people put too much stress on education than sikhi. The things we learn in school arnt going to be of any use after we die, but the naam we japed and the things we learned from bani will. For example ever since I was young my parents said their is only use in education and nothing else, but if they had put that much emphasize on sikhi than education who knows where i would be.

What are your thoughts on this? Do you think I am wrong? Do you think I am right?

Honestly I dont know if I am right or wrong. Sometimes I think I am right; sometimes wrong.

 

It's important for Sikhs to well rounded.

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4 hours ago, MisterrSingh said:

Yes! Oliver Twist put me off Dickens until I forced myself to read ACC. I don't know why Twist has gained the reputation it has. I find it to be quite embarrassingly cloying at times. That's probably the style he was going for, but still it's a bit much. Even something as apparently preachy as ACC doesn't lay it on as thick as I'd anticipated, which was a good thing.

I'll be going through those two titles you mentioned. I don't think i have them in my collection, so I may have to pick them up. I do have Great Expectations (unread), but as I said after reading Twist I was put off from reading anything from Dickens, lol. 

Great Expectations is another one of his great ones in my opinion. I think you have to totally forget OT and rediscover his writing. When you read his works notice the occasional, tiny snippets where he refers to people who were going to the 'colonies', especially India. Judging by the passing references I've read, he seems to have deemed them as losers of sorts without much going on for them here. It's relevant to us because his writings cover the period that we Sikhs were attacked and colonised by these people. So it gives us an insight into how some of these colonisers were perceived back home. 

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