Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Tony

Gurudwara Protocol

Recommended Posts

True, Satkar and fear are missing nowadays. The children will do as their parents are doing. I don't know why people are on the phone during ardas and Hukam. I think it's because they don't know what to do themselves or have any idea of what's happening. I think an announcement should be made and education on the meanings of purpose of Ardas and Hukam. And also Gurdwara Satkar and etiquette. Leaflets should be handed out to Sangat as they enter or leave the Gurdwara, written in both Gurmukhi and English.

There should be classes for children about this issue too, and parents should be encouraged to practice at home.

You are right about the kids being let loose in Darbar Sahib, but kids are more naughty nowadays and the methods of discipline are different, so that's the reason why parents give in to the children, as there is not enough discipline. Some are afraid to raise their voices or discipline with a strict tone.

The langar hall idea is good, as kids being kids get bored quick. The setting in the Gurdwara should also be like school.

kids always have tested the boundaries from time immemorial , but the parents now have zero satkar for Guru ji themselves that why they just shrug and smile like idiots when you point out that their darlings are being noisy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

same reasons why they themselves come dressed like they are going clubbing rather than to see the King of Kings

True, When I went to India, it's worse there. If women are attending a family Paat, they will wear the brightest colour suit, and I was pressured into wearing one too, but I told them straight, I don't think so and gave told them that's not what we go to the Gurdwara for. I think I offended a few people, but I don't care because I'm not going to dress up like I'm in a beauty contest. Obviously I wore a lighter colour and I don't know why some women like to dress up like clowns. I love the colours of God but some do go OTT, fluorescent. ? Edited by simran345

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Old but excellent post from another forum

Here are some basic rules that should be enforced in the Gurdwara Sahib. Please try to follow as many as you can, MOST of them are common sense. If you have any questions about anything, ASK SOMEONE. If you don’t know anyone to ask, ask the heads of your gurdwara. Feel free to add anything you think needs to be added, but please ensure that it is in line with Gurmat. Lastly, please forward this to anyone who goes to the gurdwara. You may also want to print it out and post it up at your gurdwara.
>>>>

Basics:

1. Cover your head
2. Wash hands (if your feet are dirty wash them too. Many gurdwaray have a separate place for washing feet. If not, wash them in the sink or with water on your hands.)
3. Take shoes and socks off


Other stuff:

**most of these are common sense if you pay attention to number 4.

4. Keep in mind that sitting in darbaar where Guru Granth Sahib Jee is is the same thing as sitting in darbaar where Guru Nanak Dev jee/any other guru sahib is.. this point cant be stressed enough...most people would be more careful as to how they behave in darbaar if it was any other guru than guru granth sahib jee. Have as much respect, humility etc. in Guru Granth Sahib Jee's darbaar as you would in Guru Gobind Singh Jee's darbaar.

5. If someone has their eyes closed DO NOT DISTURB THEM (unless absolutely necessary). They are most likely concentrating on whats going on.. not sleeping.

6. When matha tekking, do it as if guru nanak dev jee is there... because he is.

7. Dont wear inappropriate clothing (i.e. tight clothes, shirts with low necks, shirts that show half your stomach, bright flashy sparkly suits, multicoloured suits, extravagant suits...)

8. Cover your head PROPERLY at all times. "it slipped off my head" shouldnt be an excuse.

9. Don't talk while in the darbaar, even if you can't understand doesnt mean other people aren't paying attention. Your talking will disturb them. Try to listen to whats going on and you'll catch onto a few things. Even if you dont, ask your parents or just keep quiet and do simran.

10. If you see a friend sitting nearby or walking across, dont start frantically waving at him/her. If you must talk to him/her right then, go outside and do it.

11. NO TALKING whatsoever during ardaas/vaak.

12. When getting parshad, put your hands up high so that its easier for the sevadaar and make sure to use both hands.

13. When eating parshad, dont play around with it.. just accept it and eat it.

14. Do not DANCE, or even move your shoulders to the beat when kirtan is going on. Its not bhangra.

15. Dont pay attention to what other people are wearing.

16. LISTEN to what is going on.

17. keep mobiles, pagers etc off.. or if you must, keep it atleast on vibe so that it disturbs no one but you.

18. If your cell DOES ring, take it out immediately and turn it off. Don't leave it ringing in your pocket/purse thinking that no one else can hear it. DO NOT EVER talk on your phone in teh darbaar.

19. If you see someone else talking, kindly ask them to quiet down.

20. for ANY seva in the darbaar, your hands MUST be washed and you should have a hazooria (long piece of cloth around your neck)

21. For deg di seva, hands obviously must be thoroughly washed. When giving out deg, don't talk to people.. dont even sing "satnam vaheguru" (or whatever they're singing) with the rest of the sangat because its possible that some spit from your mouth could fall into the deg. the best thing to do would be to wrap your hazooria around your mouth.

22. In the langar hall, while doing seva, hands MUST once again be thoroughly washed. This is very important.

23. If you're serving langar, dont talk to people unnecessarily.

24. When your serving OR eating langar, your head must be covered.

25. Dont go boasting to people of how much seva you do (or how many times you go to the gurdwara), this just defeats the whole purpose.

26. The Gurdwara is not a social place. You dont go to meet up with people or to show off your new suit.

27. Don't push when you're in line to matha taak.

28. Do not bow down to anything other than Sri Guru Granth Sahib jee; this is considered an insult to Maharaj jee. Even if there is another pothi in the darbaar with other bani in it, the ultimate jyot of Guru Sahib is in SGGS.

29. Try to sit cross legged when in the gurdwara.

30. Don’t sit against the wall, please reserve this area for the elderly.

31. Don’t sit at the back, find a nice spot from where you can pay attention to what is going on.

32. Dont bring any food into the darbaar

33. Teach your kids the proper way to matha tek. Some kids throw money towards SGGSJ like they're doing Guru ji a favor and then don't even bow down.

34. NO GUM!!!!!!

35. Try to stay inside the gurudwara at most times. You disturb people when you go in and out ....or if you know you're going to leave in the middle of the services, sit near the exit.

36. Participate in the programme currently going on in Gurudwara sahib like if Kirtan is going on then sit and listen and try to understand the Kirtan. Many people start doing other Paath (sukhmani sahib or others) in the Gurudwara Hall when Kirtan or katha (lectures on gurmat) are going on. A student (Sikh) should listen to what is going on (katha/ kirtan) in classroom (gurudwara) at that particular period of time. If any body really needs to do other paath then they should go to a separate room instead of doing it in the main hall.

37. The Gurdwara is not a playground, if you wanna play, play outside, not in the guru darbar or guru ka langar.

38. No portable game consoles or mobile phones with games. I have seen teenagers playing these during a diwan (session in the gurdwara).

39. No T-shirts or clothes with offensive writing like FCUK tops or beer ads or anything anti-Gurmat.

40. When coming to the Gurdwara, try to spend more time in the darbar rather then spending more time outside talking. Some people might spend 15mins in the darbar and then 2-3 hours talking outside like they are going to sort out important Panthic issues or bhaji/bhenji clubs, we know how these can end up!!. As mentioned before, the gurdwara is not a social meeting place.

41. Teach younger kids to sit inside the darbar... they're never going to learn anything if they play outside during kirtan!!

42. Try to stay in the darbar for as long as the program is going on. Stay to listen to the hukamnama, even if you don’t understand. If Guru Gobind Singh jee was giving an order to his Sikhs, you would most likely want to stay and hear what he has to say. Same thing at the gurdwara.

Vaheguroo jee ka Khalsa Vaheguroo jee kee Fateh!!!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The main problem here is ignorance. The sangat trust the raagis and the Giani jis to know what they are doing and do it the right way.

I think the lowering of the standards of kirtan performance is because most Giani jis we have performing this seva have actually turned to kirtan as a way of getting out of India.

We personally knew a Giani ji who was actually a person who rows people across the river... kisti chalaun vala and he learned a few tunes on the vaja. As long as you can sing some gurbani on the vaja - outside country committees will be fooled as to you can perform kirtan. He had a forged giani certificate. The sakhis he told us - got mixed up in between and he had a business running on the side for him. In his free time he was selling stuff to people and even this stuff was sort of fake. Once someone bought a fixo from him and it was watery and useless.

He forged reciepts too. A lady gave him 50 shillings and he cleverly wrote her a receipt of 50 and on the carbon copy it said 5. The lady came to my dad who was sevadaar at that time. This was all insider information which we were able to get at because my dad had access to the paper copies of the Guradwara.

As long as this continues and we keep getting fooled, kirtan maryada cannot be adhered to. Another giani ji - this one was a genuine one came and he was all the time getting framed up by these others. No one has the time to follow up activities which go on in guradwaras.

Our committees are the ones who employ people from India and they can only respond to applications they receive. No one makes an active effort to go seek the actual real and well trained giani's who will perform kirtan in maryada and not look at it as a way of simply making money.

These gianis then move on from countries like Kenya to go on to canada and Uk.

If possible then we should have our own trained youth to perform kirtan in the Guradwaras. There is no place where at present (or maybe there is) where a reputable person from India can impart such precious knowledge to our own youngsters who can learn and perform kirtan and also educate the sangat on the correct way of performing kirtan.

I agree we should have numerous vidhalayas for raag kirtan and gurbani santhiya, calligraphy, sikh itihass, parchaar; each Sikh should be able to be kirtaniya,granthi, scribe if and when needed. I mean sikhs have been set up in Uk , USA and Canada over one hundred years now; it is more than time . I think that is where daswand should go to , and we should have a rota of guest lecturers from the taksals and other sangeet schools so what we lack can be fufilled and we can ensure parchaar is multifaceted, high quality and multilingual , customised to conditions on the ground (grooming issues, interfaith issues, Caste removal). Since SGPC is now antisikh in nature I can see no one objecting except those who are bought by antisikh elements in India

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The main problem here is ignorance. The sangat trust the raagis and the Giani jis to know what they are doing and do it the right way.

I think the lowering of the standards of kirtan performance is because most Giani jis we have performing this seva have actually turned to kirtan as a way of getting out of India.

We personally knew a Giani ji who was actually a person who rows people across the river... kisti chalaun vala and he learned a few tunes on the vaja. As long as you can sing some gurbani on the vaja - outside country committees will be fooled as to you can perform kirtan. He had a forged giani certificate. The sakhis he told us - got mixed up in between and he had a business running on the side for him. In his free time he was selling stuff to people and even this stuff was sort of fake. Once someone bought a fixo from him and it was watery and useless.

He forged reciepts too. A lady gave him 50 shillings and he cleverly wrote her a receipt of 50 and on the carbon copy it said 5. The lady came to my dad who was sevadaar at that time. This was all insider information which we were able to get at because my dad had access to the paper copies of the Guradwara.

As long as this continues and we keep getting fooled, kirtan maryada cannot be adhered to. Another giani ji - this one was a genuine one came and he was all the time getting framed up by these others. No one has the time to follow up activities which go on in guradwaras.

Our committees are the ones who employ people from India and they can only respond to applications they receive. No one makes an active effort to go seek the actual real and well trained giani's who will perform kirtan in maryada and not look at it as a way of simply making money.

These gianis then move on from countries like Kenya to go on to canada and Uk.

If possible then we should have our own trained youth to perform kirtan in the Guradwaras. There is no place where at present (or maybe there is) where a reputable person from India can impart such precious knowledge to our own youngsters who can learn and perform kirtan and also educate the sangat on the correct way of performing kirtan.

I agree we should have numerous vidhalayas for raag kirtan and gurbani santhiya, calligraphy, sikh itihass, parchaar; each Sikh should be able to be kirtaniya,granthi, scribe if and when needed. I mean sikhs have been set up in Uk , USA and Canada over one hundred years now; it is more than time . I think that is where daswand should go to , and we should have a rota of guest lecturers from the taksals and other sangeet schools so what we lack can be fufilled and we can ensure parchaar is multifaceted, high quality and multilingual , customised to conditions on the ground (grooming issues, interfaith issues, Caste removal). Since SGPC is now antisikh in nature I can see no one objecting except those who are bought by antisikh elements in India

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Be nice to get the gossiping women out of the kitchens and langar hall into the Darbar Sahib!

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Be nice to get men into the kitchen in the first place

The only positions in the committee offered to the women are "kitchen di seva", with the exception of Sri Guru Singh Sabha Hounslow, where females have actually had leadership roles (stage secretary).

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

True, When I went to India, it's worse there. If women are attending a family Paat, they will wear the brightest colour suit, and I was pressured into wearing one too, but I told them straight, I don't think so and gave told them that's not what we go to the Gurdwara for. I think I offended a few people, but I don't care because I'm not going to dress up like I'm in a beauty contest. Obviously I wore a lighter colour and I don't know why some women like to dress up like clowns. I love the colours of God but some do go OTT, fluorescent.

The worst one was during the day I went to do matha tek and listen to sukhmani sahib at Karamsar Gurdwara . One lady comes in with two guys , the guys had full body clothing, ts and jeans however she was in a low cut vest top with white linen capri shorts on , when she did matha tek you could see everything through the cloth of her trousers ...or should I say lack of coverage of her underwear . The bibian who were of the older generation took one look and and told her to her face that one does not come before your father naked so why come before Guru ji this way ? The old guys were so flustered they could only look on the ground they were ashamed for her , but she was zero bothered. And that is the thing such people would dress demurely if it was an invitation to a Queen's tea party at Buckingham but because they do not recognise Guru Granth Sahib as the living Guru they pull this disrespectful attitude out.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Be nice to get men into the kitchen in the first place

The only positions in the committee offered to the women are "kitchen di seva", with the exception of Sri Guru Singh Sabha Hounslow, where females have actually had leadership roles (stage secretary).

I reckon they should put the men in charge of langar and the women in charge of day to day running of the Gurdwara I reckon the women would actually be more open to new initiatives to teach sikhi and not see it as a personal affront like the guys and The langar would become simpler and run without so much chitchat

Edited by jkvlondon
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Be nice to get men into the kitchen in the first place

The only positions in the committee offered to the women are "kitchen di seva", with the exception of Sri Guru Singh Sabha Hounslow, where females have actually had leadership roles (stage secretary).

I've been to a few Gurdwaras where the men are doing the Langar, rightfully. Equality in the Gurdwara is essential

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this  

×