BhagatBalmik

Doing Paath But No Simran

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Waheguru

Have been noticing that alot of people who do there nitnam or who read sukhmani sahib dont do any simran. They feel that only reading Gurbani is enough. Its good that there reading Gurbani but every shabd in Guru Granth Sahib Ji has the Mahima of Naam. I have asked people who read sukhmani sahib everyday, do you do simran and they say no, that reading is good enough. One of the lines from Sukhmani Sahib is 'Prab ka Simran Sab Ti Uchha'. I wanted the Sangats opinion, how do you reason with a person who says doing only Paath is enough. Also is there any Sangat member who reads only Gurbani and doesnt do Simran. Waheguru.

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VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

Answer in first 2 minutes.

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You do not understand the concepts of Gurbani .When we are doing gurbani we are doing simran.If not satisfied read any biography of mahapursh like 'se kinehiya'.

Edited by NavdeepSingh74
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You do not understand the concepts of Gurbani .When we are doing gurbani we are doing simran.If not satisfied read any biography of mahapursh like 'se kinehiya'.

How do you DO gurbani?..... do you mean when we recite it with love for guru sahib and understand their message and teachings and then put it into practice.....

if you do that then you should jaap naam as much as you can......

or are you trying to say that waheguru is not our gurmantar and we shouldn't recite it and contemplate it in deep meditation, that instead reading banis are a type of naam japna and thats enough?

This view i dont agree with, but to each his own. you're entitled to your opinion.....

SO r u saying that u never actually sit down at amritvela and meditate on Gurmantar????

SO what does your amritvela routine workout to be like......do you just do your nitnem dia bania and thats it?

I dunno man, whenever i dont do simran my day never goes well....lol

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Waheguru

....................One of the lines from Sukhmani Sahib is 'Prab ka Simran Sab Ti Uchha'. I wanted the Sangats opinion, how do you reason with a person who says doing only Paath is enough. Also is there any Sangat member who reads only Gurbani and doesnt do Simran. Waheguru.

Excellent point.

One can read a book on ''how to swim'' as many times as they want, but it will be of little help to save someone drowning unless they did some actual practice.

In the same way, gurbani and especially the 1st ashtpadhi of sukhmani sahib quoted above....is telling us to do the practice of simran in order to swim across this bhavsagar-turbulent world ocean.

However, I am aware that some people can also get themselves into states of meditative simran by reciting gurbani. This is usually when they are doing many repeated paaths throughout the day such as countless japji sahib paaths...... or x amount of sukhmani sahib paaths... such that the recitation becomes automatic just like simran jap.

.

Edited by luckysingh99
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SO r u saying that u never actually sit down at amritvela and meditate on Gurmantar????

Amrit vela meditating on gurmantar is what Guru prescribes us for daily cleansing of mind.

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How do you DO gurbani?..... do you mean when we recite it with love for guru sahib and understand their message and teachings and then put it into practice.....

if you do that then you should jaap naam as much as you can......

or are you trying to say that waheguru is not our gurmantar and we shouldn't recite it and contemplate it in deep meditation, that instead reading banis are a type of naam japna and thats enough?

This view i dont agree with, but to each his own. you're entitled to your opinion.....

SO r u saying that u never actually sit down at amritvela and meditate on Gurmantar????

SO what does your amritvela routine workout to be like......do you just do your nitnem dia bania and thats it?

I dunno man, whenever i dont do simran my day never goes well....lol

When we do any path for enormous amount of time like 10-15 hour a day ,we start getting detached from the world.And obviously one cannot simply sit and do this much time of path without guru's sikhya(which is Gurbani) and blessing.Then we get some avastha like we are always in a blissful state and remember waheguru everytime.As we continue the 'WAHEGURU' mantar can be heard in our heart,body and whole universe.Although they are very high avastas to be reached.But from this we can say that every word of Gurbani is directly related to 'WAHEGURU'.

Edited by NavdeepSingh74

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Totally agree with spiritual yearning and innocent love.


The problem is with our rigid mindset that we are trying to box gurbani into technicalities, divide gurbani into naam and patt and then try to turn that into black and white rules.


What is naam simran? It's remembrance of Guru, shabad dhun, shabad gyan-truth without any technicalities in utter innocence love/pure earnestness/yearning. Some technicalities-vidhi-dridh/inquiry helps as pointer but the main point itself- its what pointer is pointing towards.


It's true whole gurbani is naam simran roop but its also true specific gurmantar/mool mantar is also naam simran.


So naam simran is remembrance of Vahiguru-Guru maharaj-sargun saroop parkash, shabad dhun, gurbani gyan-bhramgyan-truth


Akaal ustat talks about many rigid mindset, technicalities how they all failed and declares only pure love, yearning will get you there which is pure change in one's perception how seeker perceive. It has everything to do with how seeker perceive/feel (change in perception) and has very little to do with technicalities (whether simran on naam-gurmantar/gurbani is superior or not).


It's the feeling/perception of seeker (if spiritual deep impulse yearning/truth yearning/love yearning is there or not) who is doing it, thats remains the main focus


Gurbani speaks to all seekers-


ਗਉੜੀ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥ गउड़ी महला ५ ॥

Ga▫oṛī mėhlā 5. Gauree, Fifth Mehl:


ਨੇਤ੍ਰ ਪ੍ਰਗਾਸੁ ਕੀਆ ਗੁਰਦੇਵ ॥ नेत्र प्रगासु कीआ गुरदेव ॥

Neṯar pargās kī▫ā gurḏev. The Divine Guru has opened his eyes.


ਭਰਮ ਗਏ ਪੂਰਨ ਭਈ ਸੇਵ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ भरम गए पूरन भई सेव ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ Bẖaram ga▫e pūran bẖa▫ī sev. ||1|| rahā▫o.

Doubt has been dispelled; my service has been successful. ||1||Pause||


For example-

Above gurbani tukh speaks to all aspirants/devotees-


-Blind person can do simran with gurbani truth above with full faith, devotion, love can get eye sight back


- Pure innocent sargun upasakh devotee of our Guru sahib also do simran with gurbani truth above have partakh sargun darshan of guru sahib.


- Devotee with faith, devotion, love can also contemplate on gurbani truth above have his third eye open, leading to dasam dwar opening and transcedent in their spirituality


- Devotee with faith, devotion, love can also contemplate on gurbani truth with perception of pure knowledge/oneness, and have his real self JOT- gyan parkash awakened.


Ultimately, its quite simple- Gurbani is ALIVE JAGAD JOT(Shabad gyan roop) in live experience and timeless- which is in all of us, always here and eternal- either we let it consume us by being completely empty-innocence love (yet dead while live-conditioned mind die before you die) and let it take our centre being let ALIVE JAGAD jot operate or wear shield- conditioned mindset, egoic mindset, mindset with technicalities- wrap our head around with more and more conceptual technicality

Edited by N30S1NGH
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It depends on what avasta you are at. If you are at stage where you are repeating Gurbani separately and then later Japping gurmantar then doing both is important. A stage will eventually come where there is no difference between naam and gurbani so then you won't need to worry. Also throughout this journey I would like to state that your definition of naam will keep changing as your understanding increases.

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Also throughout this journey I would like to state that your definition of naam will keep changing as your understanding increases.

Totally agree, this is from bhai vir singh ji -

What is Naam?

By Bhai sahib Bhai Vir Singh Ji

Naam in the words of Bhai Sahib Bhai Vir Singh Ji

When this eternal pure light meets with the spark of light within you, at that moment enlightenment takes place. Your life as you know it ceases. This pure light transforms you. Wonder and gratitude fill every pore of your being.

If this union does not take place, then you continue to live like an extinguished lamp, low in spirits and powerless to rise above worldly desires. This is the cause of pain and suffering. So train your mind to always remain in the presence of the Divine.

Think, when you remember someone, is your attention not that person? Attention is the essence in this world. When you give something your total attention, the work gets accomplished. But when the attention gets diverted, the work suffers. When a student gives his attention to his education, he gets educated. Similarly, if you focus your attention on the Divine and its attributes, you too will reap the benefits. So raise your consciousness above the seen world and focus your attention on the Divine.

When you begin to feel the love of the Divine within your mind and body, know that grace has been bestowed. This is naam.

Dyed in the love of the Divine you will see the Divine pervading everywhere. This is naam.

When your attention turns from the seen world, towards the Divine world, that is also naam.

Naam is not mere repetition.

Naam is repetition, recitation, remembrance and sensation.

Naam is life.

Naam is grace.

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Waheguru

What im talking about is how some sikhs dont set aside time to jap the Gurmanter. Reading Gurbani is not japing the Gurmanter.

Like waking up at amrit wela and jap waheguru waheguru

One who calls himself a Sikh of the Guru, the True Guru, shall rise in the early morning hours and meditate on the Lord`s Name.

gur satgur kaa jo sikh akhaa-ay so bhalkay uth har naam Dhi-aavai.

Remember the earlys sikhs like Sajjan Thug didn't have Gurbani to read they just got the Gurmanter from Sri Guru Nanak Sahib Ji to jap and most sikhs couldnt read anyways.

Bhai Gurdas Waheguru Gurmanter hai Jap houmi koi

The point im trying to make is alot of sikhs dont jap naam they think just reading gurbani is all you have to do. Reading Gurbani is good and we should do that, but every shabd in gurbani is about japping the Gumanter. We should set aside couple of hours, where we sit down close our eyes and begain to repeat waheguru waheguru and have love for the Gurmanter.

That is my question does this sangat set aside time to jap the gurmanter like in the early morning.

waheguru

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As per rehat, Gurmantar jap at amrit vela is in addition to nitnem bania.

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I have noticed since adding Gurmantar jaap to my nitnem at amritvela, life is even more blissful. There is something so beautiful and powerful about our Gurmantar. We definitely should take time out to reflect, be grateful and experience the significance of this.

Also agree that Gurbani can help get into meditative feels like simran...especially if we do e.g. 10+ Japji sahib per day over a month or so. 

What motivated me to start Gurmantar simran was someone said what's the point of reading nitnem, sehaj paath, etc? At the end of the day what is said by Sri Guru Granth Sahib over and over again? simple, to remember Waheguru. So why don't we? That made me rethink, hope it helps you out. 

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Vahiguroo kirpa dya _/\_,

impossible to achieve any living amongst smoking etc neighbors, especially with walls thin like paper, and unable to afford to move to Gursikh area, to truly progressin bhagti

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in jail chittian of Bhai Randhir Singh Jio, Bhai Sahib made benti for ardas, so he could be free of such prison condition.  

Bhai Sahib did intense Gurbani atey Naam bhagti, and received Vahiguroo darshan, yet he knew he had to be free from bad prison surroundings.

Bhagti anand is impossible amongst non sikhs, atey non practising sikhs, who convinced their kurr happiness, and Vahiguroo seekers are the misfits of society

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11 minutes ago, sitokaur said:

in jail chittian of Bhai Randhir Singh Jio, Bhai Sahib made benti for ardas, so he could be free of such prison condition.  

Bhai Sahib did intense Gurbani atey Naam bhagti, and received Vahiguroo darshan, yet he knew he had to be free from bad prison surroundings.

Bhagti anand is impossible amongst non sikhs, atey non practising sikhs, who convinced their kurr happiness, and Vahiguroo seekers are the misfits of society

I'm confused 

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Vahiguroo, whether doing Gurbani or Naam Simran, it is also important to be living amongst Gursikhs ONLY_/\_

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3 hours ago, sitokaur said:

impossible to achieve any living amongst smoking etc neighbors, especially with walls thin like paper,

This is the norm for most people. If it's not smoking inside one's own house, then I don't see how it will affect somebody's spirituality. Neighbours - everybody has neighbours, but if they are very noisy, then ask them politely to keep it down. There are laws against noise and what's not accepted. 

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2 hours ago, sitokaur said:

Vahiguroo seekers are the misfits of society

This seems a negative description, are you sure you've written this right? 

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Simran345 Jio, neighbor's noise is nit a big issue, but neighbor's tobacco smoke does affect one's mind (smoke somehow gets in my home too) atey health (my mother suffered and passed from asthma, she contracted from neighbor's secnd hand tobacco smoke).

Regarding negative description of Vahiguroo seekers, my facebook had post of ,'religious nasties,' term used by person who had immoral profile photo, just one of many.

 

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12 hours ago, Sukhvirk1976 said:

I'm confused 

Do you think you are the only one? It is becomiing increasingly difficult to understand their posts, yet, they are all in English!! It is difficult to respond to them.

Edited by OnieFaltoo
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9 hours ago, sitokaur said:

Simran345 Jio, neighbor's noise is nit a big issue, but neighbor's tobacco smoke does affect one's mind (smoke somehow gets in my home too) atey health (my mother suffered and passed from asthma, she contracted from neighbor's secnd hand tobacco smoke).

Regarding negative description of Vahiguroo seekers, my facebook had post of ,'religious nasties,' term used by person who had immoral profile photo, just one of many.

 

Thank you Sito penji for clarying this. I thought you meant the public outside smoking passing by. I wasn't aware that neighbours smoking could come through to another semi-detached or terraced house. In the garden, I can imagine that, it would be awful. Sorry to hear about your mother. 

Still don't understand the Waheguru seekers bit, but not to worry. I'll figure it out. 

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simran345,

I live in a totally worldly environment, so to attempt to be a devout Sikh is considered behaving odd.

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