Doing Paath But No Simran

[BhagatBalmik]

Waheguru

Have been noticing that alot of people who do there nitnam or who read sukhmani sahib dont do any simran. They feel that only reading Gurbani is enough. Its good that there reading Gurbani but every shabd in Guru Granth Sahib Ji has the Mahima of Naam. I have asked people who read sukhmani sahib everyday, do you do simran and they say no, that reading is good enough. One of the lines from Sukhmani Sahib is 'Prab ka Simran Sab Ti Uchha'. I wanted the Sangats opinion, how do you reason with a person who says doing only Paath is enough. Also is there any Sangat member who reads only Gurbani and doesnt do Simran. Waheguru.

[ms514]

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

Answer in first 2 minutes.

[NavdeepSingh74]

You do not understand the concepts of Gurbani .When we are doing gurbani we are doing simran.If not satisfied read any biography of mahapursh like 'se kinehiya'.

[sssSSinghh]

You do not understand the concepts of Gurbani .When we are doing gurbani we are doing simran.If not satisfied read any biography of mahapursh like 'se kinehiya'.

How do you DO gurbani?..... do you mean when we recite it with love for guru sahib and understand their message and teachings and then put it into practice.....

if you do that then you should jaap naam as much as you can......

or are you trying to say that waheguru is not our gurmantar and we shouldn't recite it and contemplate it in deep meditation, that instead reading banis are a type of naam japna and thats enough?

This view i dont agree with, but to each his own. you're entitled to your opinion.....

SO r u saying that u never actually sit down at amritvela and meditate on Gurmantar????

SO what does your amritvela routine workout to be like......do you just do your nitnem dia bania and thats it?

I dunno man, whenever i dont do simran my day never goes well....lol

[luckysingh99]

Waheguru

....................One of the lines from Sukhmani Sahib is 'Prab ka Simran Sab Ti Uchha'. I wanted the Sangats opinion, how do you reason with a person who says doing only Paath is enough. Also is there any Sangat member who reads only Gurbani and doesnt do Simran. Waheguru.

Excellent point.

One can read a book on ''how to swim'' as many times as they want, but it will be of little help to save someone drowning unless they did some actual practice.

In the same way, gurbani and especially the 1st ashtpadhi of sukhmani sahib quoted above....is telling us to do the practice of simran in order to swim across this bhavsagar-turbulent world ocean.

However, I am aware that some people can also get themselves into states of meditative simran by reciting gurbani. This is usually when they are doing many repeated paaths throughout the day such as countless japji sahib paaths...... or x amount of sukhmani sahib paaths... such that the recitation becomes automatic just like simran jap.

.

[luckysingh99]

SO r u saying that u never actually sit down at amritvela and meditate on Gurmantar????

Amrit vela meditating on gurmantar is what Guru prescribes us for daily cleansing of mind.

[Akalifauj]

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

Answer in first 2 minutes.

I listened to 5 minutes of this katha, even though i have listened to it before, but all i want to do is jaikara as loud as I can. This katha is amazing for those who can understand the deep connection this Gurmukh is speaking about.

Doing paath and simran are not in contrast with each other and they should not be made into a competition of which is better or pick one over the other. Mool Mantra is Gurbani, Vaheguru is Gurbani and Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji is Gurbani, so where is the difference? Religion has always been on sale and people will always be robbed blind by those who want to use religion as a profit machine. Today we have two sides trying to market their interpretation of Sikhi for their own pockets. One side calls them Missionaries and allies. Other side calls them Sant Samj and allies. Both are robbing you of your right of religion (to find your true origin). I have listened to both sides and spoken with both sides about where they make mistakes. Both of them refuse to recognize their mistakes because it would mean they cannot market their brand of Sikhi anymore. Their pockets will get lighter and many of their allies will be left in the dust without any support because now their true face is shown. I won't name people, but these people are the main sales reps for the missionary side and the Sant Samj side. They sit on stages talk big and when behind closed doors they have no answers for simple questions. The missionary main sales rep straight out lied to me after confessing to something. I was so disgusted by this guy. After I wished I had video taped the whole conversation. The Sant Samj main sales rep straight out degraded Guru Sahib. Both sides are making a mockery of Sikhi. This so called debate over Naam Simran and paath is one of the debates they have purposely brought into sell their brand of Sikhi.

Some people who are starting in Sikhi are put off by Vaheguru simran because they are repeating Vaheguru and they don't know why or understand what Vaheguru means, therefore can't feel anything. They feel like a recording. These are the people missionary exploit. They don't have the deep inner connection to turn up the vibration of Gurbani to build the love for Vaheguru simran. So they must understand what Vaheguru simran is through reading Gurbani or a Gurmukhs katha on Gurbani. I have stood next to Gurmukhs and my mind automatically starts doing Vaheguru simran and some stand next to these Gurmukhs and feel nothing. I am completely overtaken by the simran and cannot stop even if I wanted too. What is missing in the person, who feels nothing. Vaheguru is in them as he is in me. So is Naam in them. It's a deeper connection/yearning/love they miss. Love is the churning stick. The more you churn the deeper the connection we have with Guru Sahib. Constantly be searching for Guru Sahib and Guru Sahib will come to you in Gurbani Shabad form or Vaheguru simran form or mool mantra form. How many people are looking for a soul mate in life and look everywhere they go. They look for their soul mate in every part of the world. But how many do the same for Vaheguru? Then I have met those, who feel nothing from listening to Gurbani. They find no point on listening to Gurbani because they don't feel a connection. If we ask the missionary side, should this person stop reading Gurbani because now it is only parroting? He will laugh like a troll and make some stupid comments to out smart you because now you are insulting his brand of Sikhi (doing Vaheguru simran is parroting) in front of his customers. Can't let those pockets get light, but can cheat you out of religion. Vaheguru simran and reading Gurbani are both pure and true. So where is the problem? The problem lies inside the person, who is not searching deep enough. Don't let the maya Vaheguru has given you fill the yearning in your heart. It can't help you fill the emptiness.

Then we have the buffoon, Sant Samj brigade who says reading Gurbani is not doing simran. If reading Gurbani is not doing simran (remembering) than, who was Guru Sahib writing about (remembering)? Was he writing about some naked yogi sitting in the mountains named Buffoon? This really eats me up because these chelas the sant samj brigade don't even send to do their dirty work, say these ignorant things from their own mind. What it clearly shows is that they don't read Gurbani and are only parroting what Guru Sahib has written down. Reading Gurbani, mool mantra, Vaheguru, listening to Gurbani, mool mantra, Vaheguru, and singing Gurbani, mool mantra, and Vaheguru is all simran. In all three ways we do simran of Vaheguru, if our hearts in it. Anyone who makes an argument between these three are the biggest buffoon in the world. Keep your mind far away from these ignorant teachings.

[NavdeepSingh74]

How do you DO gurbani?..... do you mean when we recite it with love for guru sahib and understand their message and teachings and then put it into practice.....

if you do that then you should jaap naam as much as you can......

or are you trying to say that waheguru is not our gurmantar and we shouldn't recite it and contemplate it in deep meditation, that instead reading banis are a type of naam japna and thats enough?

This view i dont agree with, but to each his own. you're entitled to your opinion.....

SO r u saying that u never actually sit down at amritvela and meditate on Gurmantar????

SO what does your amritvela routine workout to be like......do you just do your nitnem dia bania and thats it?

I dunno man, whenever i dont do simran my day never goes well....lol

When we do any path for enormous amount of time like 10-15 hour a day ,we start getting detached from the world.And obviously one cannot simply sit and do this much time of path without guru's sikhya(which is Gurbani) and blessing.Then we get some avastha like we are always in a blissful state and remember waheguru everytime.As we continue the 'WAHEGURU' mantar can be heard in our heart,body and whole universe.Although they are very high avastas to be reached.But from this we can say that every word of Gurbani is directly related to 'WAHEGURU'.

[N30S1NGH]

Totally agree with spiritual yearning and innocent love.

The problem is with our rigid mindset that we are trying to box gurbani into technicalities, divide gurbani into naam and patt and then try to turn that into black and white rules.

What is naam simran? It's remembrance of Guru, shabad dhun, shabad gyan-truth without any technicalities in utter innocence love/pure earnestness/yearning. Some technicalities-vidhi-dridh/inquiry helps as pointer but the main point itself- its what pointer is pointing towards.

It's true whole gurbani is naam simran roop but its also true specific gurmantar/mool mantar is also naam simran.

So naam simran is remembrance of Vahiguru-Guru maharaj-sargun saroop parkash, shabad dhun, gurbani gyan-bhramgyan-truth

Akaal ustat talks about many rigid mindset, technicalities how they all failed and declares only pure love, yearning will get you there which is pure change in one's perception how seeker perceive. It has everything to do with how seeker perceive/feel (change in perception) and has very little to do with technicalities (whether simran on naam-gurmantar/gurbani is superior or not).

It's the feeling/perception of seeker (if spiritual deep impulse yearning/truth yearning/love yearning is there or not) who is doing it, thats remains the main focus

Gurbani speaks to all seekers-

ਗਉੜੀ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥ गउड़ी महला ५ ॥

Ga▫oṛī mėhlā 5. Gauree, Fifth Mehl:

ਨੇਤ੍ਰ ਪ੍ਰਗਾਸੁ ਕੀਆ ਗੁਰਦੇਵ ॥ नेत्र प्रगासु कीआ गुरदेव ॥

Neṯar pargās kī▫ā gurḏev. The Divine Guru has opened his eyes.

ਭਰਮ ਗਏ ਪੂਰਨ ਭਈ ਸੇਵ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ भरम गए पूरन भई सेव ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ Bẖaram ga▫e pūran bẖa▫ī sev. ||1|| rahā▫o.

Doubt has been dispelled; my service has been successful. ||1||Pause||

For example-

Above gurbani tukh speaks to all aspirants/devotees-

-Blind person can do simran with gurbani truth above with full faith, devotion, love can get eye sight back

- Pure innocent sargun upasakh devotee of our Guru sahib also do simran with gurbani truth above have partakh sargun darshan of guru sahib.

- Devotee with faith, devotion, love can also contemplate on gurbani truth above have his third eye open, leading to dasam dwar opening and transcedent in their spirituality

- Devotee with faith, devotion, love can also contemplate on gurbani truth with perception of pure knowledge/oneness, and have his real self JOT- gyan parkash awakened.

Ultimately, its quite simple- Gurbani is ALIVE JAGAD JOT(Shabad gyan roop) in live experience and timeless- which is in all of us, always here and eternal- either we let it consume us by being completely empty-innocence love (yet dead while live-conditioned mind die before you die) and let it take our centre being let ALIVE JAGAD jot operate or wear shield- conditioned mindset, egoic mindset, mindset with technicalities- wrap our head around with more and more conceptual technicality

[Consciousness]

It depends on what avasta you are at. If you are at stage where you are repeating Gurbani separately and then later Japping gurmantar then doing both is important. A stage will eventually come where there is no difference between naam and gurbani so then you won't need to worry. Also throughout this journey I would like to state that your definition of naam will keep changing as your understanding increases.