Sikhs Beheaded By Taliban.

[Militant Singh]

Who is avtar singh sanghera? What authority he has to advise sikhs in pakistan.

Is he same man who is Darshan ragi lover?

sikhs should map out their own strategy.

avtar singh sanghera is part of jatha thts been pakistan mre times thn any of us & has dne mre 2 help sikhs there thn us ,besides has links with pak govt. ragi is not in this issue hes been excommunicated so no point bringin him in 2 it tht issues gne

i agree with westlondonsingh

[apnepart2]

Who is Taliban?

According to one Muslim leader it is a Jew conspiracy. There is a video posted on forum where he makes this claim.

Taliban is definitly not friend of Muslims.

What he said in video

"Sunni Tehreek has gathered today not to fight with anyone but to declare name of of enemy of Islam, who in the name of Islam damaged Islam. This group (Taliban) has been known by names of Mohtzilla, Khaarji , Deobandi, Tehreeke Mujahideen, sometimes Taliban and the present situation is such that the Masters of Akayat, Kharjiyat, Mohatzilla, Ismayali, Nujdiat and Taliban is same. The link that connects them is same. Sequence of events is same. Abdul Wahaab Nijdi (i think the guy who founded current Wahabbism in Saudi) in the land of Arabia destroyed the future and aspirations of Muslims. Mazarate Sahba, Mazarate Aali-bait, Mzarate Umma, Mazare Umme Rasool and Digar were too destroyed (by wa habi). And then the same Tehreek came to Hind (India) and ismail delvi, ahmad parelvi in the name of jihad used the name of sikhs misleading they are waging war against Sikhs but in reality waged war against muslims. The first muslim against whom ismail delvi waged war was yaar muhammad yagistani, is that the name of a sikh or a muslim? it is a name of a muslim. musalmaan went against muslims and with passage of time these groups changed their names and appearances and in present times of murders they are known by name of taliban. taliban and it's various groups are actually jew conspiracy against islam which has been going on forever. they work against islam and muslims wearing cloaks of muslims"

link to thread

http://www.sikhsanga...du-about-sikhs/

How does Wahabism relates to Jews? Does Saudi support Israel? Taliban supported Laden who is sworn enemy of Saudi govt. How does all this connect?

[proactive]

The comments here strike me as a bit strange and illinformed to say the least. The Pakistani people are being murdered by the taliban in their hundreds nearly every day through bomb blasts etc and when the taliban pushed into those tribal areas last year they killed many local tribesmen, including those tribesmen who saw it as their duty to stick up for their fellow tribesmen Sikhs, who as 'hamsayas' of the local tribes are officialy part of those tribes...and it is in those areas of Pakistan where the vast majority of Pakistani Sikhs live. Not, as some may think, in Pakistan Punjab, because many of those Sikhs are not ethnicaly Punjabi anyway.

On top of all that you've got the Pakistani army losing men by the thousands fighting the taliban. And here we are blaming the Pakistani people and Pakistani government for something their own enemies did. As the pakistani people bury their dead each die after being killed by the taliban I'm sure its heartwarming for them to know that across the border in India and half way around the world there's a bunch of Sikhs that think the victims of the taliban are in fact the taliban.

The first step in winning any battle is knowing who your enemy is. We're not gonna win this battle by falling for Indian politicians vote winning tricks.

I think you must have misread the posts. The criticism was of the Taliban and not of Pakistan or Pakistanis in general. The fact is that when the Taliban took over these areas they were welcomed by the local people because they wanted Sharia law. Guess what, Sharia law also means subjecting non-Muslims to jizya and a host of other discriminatory practices such as wearing distinctive signs to denote that they are not Muslims. The Pakistan government also aided and abetted the Taliban and signed an agreement subjecting the non-Muslims of Swat to living under Sharia law. That backfired and they had to send the army in. It is not the fault of the Sikhs that the Taliban is killing Muslim civilians or attacking government troops and functionaries. The Sikhs did not aid the Taliban, they did not ask for Sharia law and yet they have suffered due to the fanaticism of the Taliban.

The Sikh channel did an excellent job in having the discussion last might. I was particularly impressed that they were able to get the sister of one of the Sikhs still being held by the Taliban on the show as well as have the Pakistan Gurdwaras committee chairman Sham Singh on the telephone. The panel also made very good contributions. Ravinder Singh of Khalsa Aid also phoned in. The facts that came out were that the situation can only get worst and Avtar Singh Sanghera's proposal was the best for the Sikhs of that area. The Gurdwaras in West Punjab have a lot of land attached to them and the Sikhs of NWFP should be thinking about their future. Some are still in a delapidated condition. What is needed around these Gurdwaras is a Sikh community that can ensure that the Gurdwaras are maintained and maryada restored. It is likely that the Taliban in Pakistan is not going to be defeated anytime soon and it only takes a few fanatics to kidnap Sikhs and cause death and destruction to the lives of the rest of the Sikhs in that area. These Sikhs could easily move to Nankana Sahib or Rori Sahib Gurdwaras. The worst thing they can do is stay in either their tribal areas or even in NWFP as they are now sitting ducks. According to the discussion the Sikhs had earlier pooled their resources and paid the ransom for another Sikh. This has led the Taliban to think of Sikhs as a way to get easy money.

[West London Singh]

^ I'm not so sure the taliban were 'welcomed' into those tribal areas last year. From what I remember of my reading they forced their way in, to the annoyance of the local tribal elders who stood to lose their authority.

I also doubt that this is mostly about money, as most of the Pakistani Sikhs up in those mountains are as uneducated and dirt poor as the local population.

But you suggesting they should just move from those areas onto the plains of Punjab is nonsense. Its as silly as a person India suggesting you move from England into Switzerland given yesterdays news about the killing of an elderly Sikh shopkeeper in England. Having read interviews with those Sikhs themselves I've noticed that they don't consider themselves Punjabi. They live their lives according to 'pashtunwali' and consider themselves ethnic pathans.

My gut feeling is that the real reason the taliban are brutally targetting Sikhs in that area is because, by all accounts, many of the local Sikhs seem to be heavily involved in the hashish trade, which obviously does little to endear themselves to the taliban.....not to mention doing little to spread the good name of Sikhi.

[AK47 JATHA LION]

Whatever the reason, Their heads were dumped in a Gurdwara. Whats the meaning of this?! So This is an attack on Sikhism itself.

U.S and British Forces are closing in the remaining Taliban. The cowards have nowhere left to hide. They've abandonned their caves and are running/hiding for their lives as the allied forces seek out and Kill each honourless Taliban they come across.

This backward Taliban has menaced people for far too long. The British armed forces shouldnt be offering bribes to the Taliban chiefs to lay down their arms. Instead they should be assasinating them.

They have no Honour. I cannot wait to see the last of them uprooted and destroyed.

Meanwhile all sikhs in Pakistan should be ready for more attacks. It might be wise to seek refuge and head towards the temples. This recent attack might be a sign of more to come.

[S1ngh]

Topic split in two parts. Other part is @

Stay on Topic.

[AK47 JATHA LION]

Last year the Taliban demolished 11 Sikh homes in Aurakzai tribal region after they failed to pay the Jazia imposed on them.

Last year the Taliban took over sikh shops/businesses and kidnapped Sikhs because after they failed to pay the Jazia imposed on them.

Now they have beheaded Sikhs for the same reason. This has nothing to do with RAW.

Its Taliban period. Its been building up to this for a while. Thats why Sikhs fled the area last year to seek refuge in Gurdwareh.

1 of the honourless man behind the beheading could be one of the Taliban commanders named Hakeemullah Mehsud.

And also the honourless Tehrik-e-Taliban chief Baitullah Mehsud.

Sikh homes were destroyed on these 2 mens orders last year after Sikhs didnt pay their jazia.

They can take their jazia for non-muslims and shove it

[GuptSingh84]

Very sad.

Pakistani Sikhs should indeed move on to Punjab and Sindh areas of Pakistan, where there are also historical gurdwaras and where its "safe".

[proactive]

^ I'm not so sure the taliban were 'welcomed' into those tribal areas last year. From what I remember of my reading they forced their way in, to the annoyance of the local tribal elders who stood to lose their authority.

I also doubt that this is mostly about money, as most of the Pakistani Sikhs up in those mountains are as uneducated and dirt poor as the local population.

But you suggesting they should just move from those areas onto the plains of Punjab is nonsense. Its as silly as a person India suggesting you move from England into Switzerland given yesterdays news about the killing of an elderly Sikh shopkeeper in England. Having read interviews with those Sikhs themselves I've noticed that they don't consider themselves Punjabi. They live their lives according to 'pashtunwali' and consider themselves ethnic pathans.

My gut feeling is that the real reason the taliban are brutally targetting Sikhs in that area is because, by all accounts, many of the local Sikhs seem to be heavily involved in the hashish trade, which obviously does little to endear themselves to the taliban.....not to mention doing little to spread the good name of Sikhi.

Your statements are ignorant at best and offensive at worst. So you think that Sikhs there are involved in the trade in drugs and hence the murder of these Sikhs. Typical dhimmi thinking. Blame the victim and exonerate the offenders. Your other statement of these Sikhs would not go to Punjab is patently false as anyone whose life is in danger and is in an impossible situation would pick up his bags and move to a safer area. Afghani Sikhs have done this and many live in the UK and Germany as well as in Delhi. The worst these Sikhs can do is remain sitting ducks relying on government assurances of security when the government cannot even protect their own workers.

[West London Singh]

^ No. My thinking is different to yours because unlike you I am able to read and listen, without jumping to conclusions. Nowhere did I say the beheadings were linked to those Sikhs being linked to drug smuggling. All i was saying, which can easily be confirmed by talking to anyone from the tribal mountain areas and reading any article and interviews about those tribal Sikhs...is that they are well known to be very heavily involved in low key hashish trading. By all accounts, it seems that is the favoured occupation among the tribal Sikhs there.

Another point you mentioned.....I live in a west London neighbourhood that has the highest concentration of Afghan Sikh refugees in the world. I know them well and don't need ill-informed lectures about them from you. So...the first point is this ; There is a world of difference between the Sikhs in Afghanistan (who are exclusively Punjabi and mostly of the mercantile arora and khatri grouing) and the Sikhs of the NWFP of Pakistan. I've read dozens of interviews with those Sikhs from last year where they proclaim their pashtunwali culture and love for Pakistan....and hatred for the way that India tries to talk on their behalf.

The thing I've noticed about this website is that it contains many people lacking in common sense and especially anything resembling a sense of humour. )For anyone contemplating visiting and joining this forum I would definately recommend they refrain from using irony). All I've done is state how it was wrong for some people here to be blaming the Pakistan people and government (who are also victims of the taliban) for something that the taliban have done. I stated how it was important to know who your enemy is. From everything I've read from the horse's mouth over the last 2 years the Pakistan Sikhs themselves definately seem to believe that India is their enemy. So....after observing the hundreds of anti-Pakistan protests all over india and Punjab over the last couple of days perhaps we should be telling them (the Indians) that if they're genuinely so concerned about the Sikhs of Pakistan why don't they join the international war effort against the taliban in Afghanistan ?

Each and every day...Pakistani, American and British soldiers are sent home to their families in body bags because they dies fighting the taliban...trying to defeat the taliban. If India genuinely has any concern about the Sikhs it should join the fight. If it doesn't want to join the fight it should shut up and stop trying to score political points. If you don't want to tell India to shut up and join the fight you should think about what your priorities are too. Like I said.....every single interview I've read with those Pakistani Sikhs reveals that they are through and through patriotic Pakistanis. They see those areas as home. Their fellow tribes men see them as fellow tribesmen. Just because groups of armed outsiders arrived in jeeps and have started terrorising the local population...it doesn't mean you have the right to tell them to go where you yourself consider 'home'. You have as much right to tell them to move as they do to tell you to move to Switzerland. THEY....are home...in the soil that they, their parents..and their parents before them were born in. YOU..on the other hand...are giving them lectures whilst sitting in a foriegn land your parents arrived in as immigrants.

I'm a Sikh....I do not panic at the first sign of adveristy. The taliban kill people. Thats what taliban do. They're not good people. Thats why so many British, American and Pakistan boys are fighting trying to defeat them. Frankly I'm ashamed that you even expect those brave Sikhs out there to quickly pack their bags and run like cowards. They're made of harder stuff than you. Firstly, even being able to live in that harsh environment in peace time reveals how tough they are. You've grown soft sitting on your comfy sofa from DFS. Is this what sums up the Sikhs of today ??? "things are getting hot......quick...lets RUN!!!!!!!"