The Sikh Channel

[aeroo]

the sikh panth is full of hatred today. there is no sence of ekt at all. this is kaljugs true face that when someone does a kata o guru gobiond singh ji and talks about dasam granth he is being slandered left right centre. instead people dont appreciate how kirtan ( kaljug me kirtan pardana) and katha vichar is going to help the youth fight against kaljug. people are more concerned about namdharis, nirmale nihangs akj, bla bla. we are traped in jatha bashing. when will the day comewhen a namdhari can sit along with aakj and have full pyar and respect eachother as waheguru recides in all. wasent the sikh chanel created to promote sikhi if whatever harbhan singh said was anti gurmat even i as a namdhari would go aginst him. i believe more kahs on gurur gobindsingh ji and dasam granth should be encouraged as people are now openly questioning the sources of our fathers beloved mithi bani. the same bani which is read in ourdaily nitnem and in amrit sanchars. lets stop slandering people for a change and encourage the mnisison of guru nanek. the day all sik jathas come togather i garentee yo tat no one wil be able to discriminate sikhs. that is when khalsa raaj will happen.

fateh

[13 Guru Kaun Hai]

veero ate bheno!

as usual the happens, sikh cannot keep the mouth shut before putt the tongue in the gear.

Truth exists in the hearts and the minds of all creatures great and small. Only human form allows you to pargat it.

leave daram raj to do his job.

if u no like sikh channel watch al- jazera?

maharaj talks bout those who get entangled with arguments in his special bani.

look in side our own boxes, and try to become pooran

whatever u sow u shall reap.....

if u do nitnem rid you sole of vair........

sikhi is all about anything and everything positive

anything negative minded negates sikhi

nanak naam chardi kalla tera bhane sarbat da bhalla

[Jujhar Singh]

Do you believe that the current leader of the naamdharis Guru Jagjit Singh is the 15th jyot of Guru Nanak Dev Ji Maharaj because the naamdhari's certainly do?

Currently I believe in One God and I believe that there are many ways of attaining 'mukhti'. Whether Guru Jagjit Singh is my Guru or isn't, isn't any of your business. However if you want to know more, contact me via PM and ill tell you.

Do you believe that Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj hid in the gupt roop of ajaipal singh for another 150 years after 1708 and then passed the guruship to Guru Balak Singh?

Again PM me and I'll tell you what I believe, it is not for me to post it on the internet.

Do you believe that Guru Gobind Singh did not allow women to take amrit and it was Guru Ram Singh who first gave amrit to women?

Yes

That's another chapter, back to the point. There needs to be very careful consideration by the Sikh Channel on who they wish to put forward as parcharaks.

The Sikh Channel is doing perfectly well, let them carry on.

[13 Guru Kaun Hai]

Oh pleaje oh please can SIkh channel

pleze can sikh channel get a slot fo baba mohinder singh nishkam sevak jatha?

be good to see these prominent gursikhs of the UK on the air tooo

if poss plese send this request forward mere brethrin

[Harjeet.Singh]

If the namdharis don't accept Siri Guru Granth Sahib, as their eternal living guru, then they just regard it as a book, hence they are not sikh, hence what are they doing on a Sikh channel? Even if the message is good, deep within they are unpure. So if they see a "good message" then it is actually bad, because people might start following them. That is not Sikhi. Guru Granth Sahib ji is our Guru, we accept no mortals as Guru.

oh chak de fateh singh saab you have so much gyan and are in so much chardiklaa that you have the autherity to comment on who is a sikh or not. oh yh your an anterjami as well as you know that kooke are bad and evil inside even if they do parchar of dasam guru and dasam grath (sorry if the word dasam granth ) offended anyone if you dont consider it bani.

why dont we for a change follow what ad grnth sahib ji says about who is a sikh o not.

1. Page305 Line 16 Raag Gaurhee: Guru Ram Das

ਗੁਰ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਕਾ ਜੋ ਸਿਖੁ ਅਖਾਏ ਸੁ ਭਲਕੇ ਉਠਿ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਵੈ ॥

gur sathigur kaa jo sikh akhaaeae s bhalakae outh har naam dhhiaavai ||

One who calls himself a Sikh of the Guru the True Guru shall rise in the early morning hours and meditate on the Lord's Name.

only akaalpurakh and the guru can decide who is their sikh or not.

fateh

Yes you are right, i have no right to judge who is sikh or not, and only waheguru, can decide who is sikh or not. But im stating fact, one who disrespects Guru, by calling them a mere book, i know for a fact, aswell as God that they are not sikh, you don't have to be God to understand that. To be a sikh of the Guru, you actually have to have a Guru. Namdharis no offense, but they don't have a guru. Im talking about satguru. You insult Guru, you insult God.

God is the Siri Guru Granth Sahib, one who calls him a mere book, is insulting Guru and is not a sikh. We should not allow it. Thats like saying, someone is trying to burn SGGS in front of you, but you are just standing there watching them and letting them do so. thinking to yourself "oh only God has a right to do something to him" That is what you are saying to me and it is absurd. Obviously not would you do this, you would try to prevent it from happening, your not going to just leave it to God.

So why is someone who doesn't believe Guru Sahib to be real, a fundamental for a Sikh, being allowed to tell sikhs what to do?

You know and I know that is wrong, are you going to let someone insult Guru ji in that way? Or are you going to be a stupid little <banned word filter activated> like me.

But stop trying to bash at me, somebody who doesn't believe in Siri Guru Granth Sahib ji as Guru, being allowed to tell Sikhs what to believe in? that is crazy.

And don't say you are not bashing me this is what you said.

oh chak de fateh singh saab you have so much gyan and are in so much chardiklaa that you have the autherity to comment on who is a sikh or not

But lets not argue, there is someone preaching to Sikhs, when he himself is not a practising Sikh. How hypocritcal is that, you must agree. The reason im talking is because you can't let somebody insult the Guru by saying their not the Guru, then let them get away with. It wouldn't normally matter what someone beleives aslong as you keep it to yourself. But to go publicially and teach sikhs when they themselves arent a sikh tat is wrong. And don't say namdharis are sikhs, they are not because they go and insult SGGS by saying he is not guru, but instead some mere mortal human is. Guru is God remember. Don't ever let someone insult our creator.

[Sarbloh]

OK. I am glad a discussion has been started on this point and it is evident that there are naamdharis on this thread too.

The katha of the Naamdhari was tactfully OK, he talked about the right things and made no reference to his own living Guru. He obviously had full awarness of who is audience was and made sure they heard what they wanted to hear. No great surprises there as most of our Granthis use the same tactic anyway!

From a panthic stand, Sri Akal Takht Sahib has given clear instructions in the form of a familiar Hukumnama (which I believe in the Rehat/Maryada section of this website) that Naamdharis and blatant followers of living Gurus should not be allowed to perform keertan or katha on the stages of Gurdwaras. This mata was passed by the Punj Singh Sahibs and signed by the Jathedar.

Naamdharis do not fall in the same category of jathebhandis, dals or sampardays as do the SGPC, AKJ, GNSSJ, Nihang Dals, Taksals, Nanaksar, Missionaries etc. The simple criteria being the accpetance that Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj finished the dehdhari Guru lineage and passed the GurGadi onto Shabad Guru in the form of Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj. There were no 11, 12, 13, 14 or 15th Gurus there on after. The dehdhari belief breaks this parampara allowing the acceptance of a Human form of the Guru to exist, Naamdharis openly do parchaar and vichaar of their further 4 Gurus after Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj

It is essential that the Sikh Channel adheres to our parampara and ensures that their representation is not only whiter than white, but also within the mainstream of Sikh maryada which is essentially adhering to the standardised Sri Akal Takht maryada and Sikh belief.

Careful consideration must be made when chosing a parcharak or presenter and their affiliation to non Sikh groups (such as Naamdharis) must also be taken into consideration. I have a slight concern that the management of the Sikh Channel may fail to take this on board.

[Harvinder singh Babbar]

namdharis r not sikhs, never will be, no difference between them or any other dera/sect out there they r just glorified, sikh channel shud admit to the mistake of letting them perform and not repeat it. jujhar who u guys got lined up as ur nxt guru after that budda jaggy dies?

[Kaljug Singh]

OK. I am glad a discussion has been started on this point and it is evident that there are naamdharis on this thread too.

The katha of the Naamdhari was OK, he tactfully talked about the right things and made no reference to his own Guru. He obviously had full awarness of who is audience was and made sure they heard what they wanted to hear. No great surprises there as most of our Granthis use the same tactic anyway.

From a panthic stand, Sri Akal Takht Sahib has given clear instructions in the form of a familiar Hukumnama (which I believe in the Rehat/Maryada section of this website) that Naamdharis and blatant followers of living Gurus should not be allowed to perform keertan or katha on the stages of Gurdwaras. This mata was passed by the Punj Singh Sahibs and signed by the Jathedar.

Naamdharis do not fall in the same category of jathebhandis, dals or sampardays as do the SGPC, AKJ, GNSSJ, Nihang Dals, Taksals, Nanaksar, Missionaries etc. The simple criteria being the accpetance that Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj finished the dehdhari Guru lineage and passed the GurGadi onto Shabad Guru in the form of Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj. There were no 11, 12, 13, 14 or 15th Gurus there on after. The dehdhari belief breaks this parampara allowing the acceptance of a Human form of the Guru to exist, which Naamdharis openly do parchaar and vichaar of.

It is essential that the Sikh Channel adheres to our parampara and ensures that their representation is not only whiter than white, but also within the mainstream of Sikh maryada which is essentially adhering to the standardised Sri Akal Takht maryada and Sikh belief.

Careful consideration must be made when chosing a parcharak or presenter and their affiliation to non Sikh groups must also be taken into consideration. I have a slight concern that the management of the Sikh Channel may fail to take this on board.

Excellent post.

To the person who compared this Naamdhari guy to Bhai Lall Ji and previous Muslim Rababis who used to perform in Harimandir Sahib: there is a huge difference between inviting Muslim followers of Guru Nanak Ji to perform kirtan and allowing the chela of some man who claims that he, and not Sri Guru Granth Sahib, is the light of Sri Guru Nanak Ji the opportunity to be part of a channel that is supposed to represent Sikhi.

Regards,

K.

[aeroo]

fateh harjeet singh

i accept your views and am tolerant to what u believe in ad grath sahib ji to be the living eternal guru. however even thou namdharis do not concider ad granth sahib ji be given the guru ganthi i assure u that namdharis do not consider it a mere book. we believe in ad granth sahib ji and dasam granth sahibji and hold equal respect to both. and do believe in 100% of al the banis contained in them including raagmala. to call gurus bani a mere book is a great insult. we believe that the granth is pavitar bani of the gurus who have contributed towards it, and even akaalpurakhs words himself. if there is any namdhari who makes such irational statments my pm is open and i will deal with this.

i don't think you know harbhan singh in person and therefore cant say if his maryada or is following sikhi.

i don't need to eplain th namdhari belief on thisforum as there are many internet websites you can get information from. i suggest if u do want to know about kooke you research upon them first then ask questions on whatever you dont understand and is not stated. i will not list the websites on this forum as i will probably end up getting banned for doing so but searching in google inset that hard.

i find it pointless debating on weather namdaris are right or wrong because you and me are not the first ones to do so tere have been many scholars wh have done in the past and have got to no conclusion. nothing is ogin to change the namdharis from believing in the continuation of the guru gathi and we believe our present guru satguru jagjit singh ji to be the akaalpurakh satguru presently. vice versa nothing is going to change the mainstream sikh from believeing in "shabad" guru. lets all be tolerant to what people believe in. humanity is the way forward. these pointless discussions are not helping our karanm and our jeevans. instead id be more than happy to discuss on how we can improve ourselves and what naamsimran techniques and experiances one has achieved. now that will be produtive wouldent it.

fateh

[Harjeet.Singh]

fateh harjeet singh

i accept your views and am tolerant to what u believe in ad grath sahib ji to be the living eternal guru. however even thou namdharis do not concider ad granth sahib ji be given the guru ganthi i assure u that namdharis do not consider it a mere book. we believe in ad granth sahib ji and dasam granth sahibji and hold equal respect to both. and do believe in 100% of al the banis contained in them including raagmala. to call gurus bani a mere book is a great insult. we believe that the granth is pavitar bani of the gurus who have contributed towards it, and even akaalpurakhs words himself. if there is any namdhari who makes such irational statments my pm is open and i will deal with this.

i don't think you know harbhan singh in person and therefore cant say if his maryada or is following sikhi.

i don't need to eplain th namdhari belief on thisforum as there are many internet websites you can get information from. i suggest if u do want to know about kooke you research upon them first then ask questions on whatever you dont understand and is not stated. i will not list the websites on this forum as i will probably end up getting banned for doing so but searching in google inset that hard.

i find it pointless debating on weather namdaris are right or wrong because you and me are not the first ones to do so tere have been many scholars wh have done in the past and have got to no conclusion. nothing is ogin to change the namdharis from believing in the continuation of the guru gathi and we believe our present guru satguru jagjit singh ji to be the akaalpurakh satguru presently. vice versa nothing is going to change the mainstream sikh from believeing in "shabad" guru. lets all be tolerant to what people believe in. humanity is the way forward. these pointless discussions are not helping our karanm and our jeevans. instead id be more than happy to discuss on how we can improve ourselves and what naamsimran techniques and experiances one has achieved. now that will be produtive wouldent it. smile.gif

fateh

One last thing then

ਬਾਣੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੁਰੂ ਹੈ ਬਾਣੀ ਵਿਚਿ ਬਾਣੀ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਸਾਰੇ ॥

The Word, the Bani is Guru, and Guru is the Bani. Within the Bani, the Ambrosial Nectar is contained.

do you think this is valid?