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Guest Amandeep Kaur
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Sounds to me like they don't know how to do swas swas simran properly, probably too fast and improper breathing, and are hyperventilating very heavily which is causing the fits.

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By the Gurdwara's name and the guest chatting about stages leading to the "Nij Ghar" and some "Anhad Sabd" i knew this was a cult like the Radha soami people. Only their Baba knows this secret LOL this is why they talk about these stages.

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gurfateh, lets address the issues presented here:

Ok, so today I went to Swindon and saw with my own eyes that all rumours I have heard are 100% true. This place has mahraj's parkash but does not feel like a gurdwara but more like a cult.

^^why did it feel like a cult? because the sangat have been together for 3+ years and we all know each other and treat other each as family?

In the sangat there are many people some lying down on the floor with their feet facing towards mahraj making groaning sounds and crying etc. The prgrammes basically consists of katha and saas girass simran. At first everything seems fine (although I did think it was a bit strange for ppl to be lying down in the gurdwara)

^^ ppl lying down on the floor have gone into sehaj/sunn there bodies are dead but there minds are awake. bhai ajit singh did explain this openly but you failed to include this in your analysis.

Then some ppl start going crazy and I don't mean like in josh or anand, they literally look like they are having a epileptic fit.

^^ No, we aren't going crazy we are passing through the tats (elements) of the body causing shaking, we do not feel any pain infact we feel anand but when we are being broken it causes us to cry as the shabad is taking us home but we are being stopped. I am stressing the 'we' because i speak from practical experience. oh and believe me it can take alot more then 3 singhs to break the shabad.

After the simran the katha began this basically consisted of Ajit Singh saying that to open ur dasam duaar is very easy and all you need is the right jugti.

^^

jugtis are only given to those who do the practical.

Basically these ppl are brainwashed by him. Although he cunningly doesn't call himself a baba, he is as bad as the worst pakhandis out there. He makes the sangat believe that brahmgian is just around the corner and the way to reach it is by coming to the programmes and getting the jugti from him.

I can totally understand why sangat are so hooked they go there with the hope of getting naam.

^^ naam is only given by the satguru not by bhai ajit singh, this was explained in the diwan 'bin nami mukt na bhavi koi bin

satgur ko naam na pai' I fail to see how he is a pakandi or baba? did he ask for money? were ppl touching his feet?? Please explain the baba aspect.

they totally ignore the fits, they ignore the ppl that are lying on the floor with their feet facing towards maharaj v.disrespectful imho (I think these ppl are suppossed to have reached some high avastha and are in total anand hence the lying down in bliss LOL.gif ) Also they leave these ppl lying down through the ardas?! If they can't even get this sort of basic maryada right how can they even dream of brahmgian?

^^ again, those that have died through the shabad and gone to the dasam dwaar or at least the 5th taat are trying to smaah, this was explained in the akath katha on how to pass the 5 tats, this stops after a short while, shame, and you get even more anand as you start to leave this body - again from practical no just hear say.

Why didnt you confront bhai ajit singh of these issues like you said you would? He openly said has anyone got any questions.

I can tell you from practical experience that me and my friends have been going for nearly 2 years...and since we have been going we have started drinking amrit, passed thru the 5 tats, my granddad has been going to 6months and he has shabads and amrit rass...i could go on but ive addressed every point here, this singh doesn't know what is happening, he doesnt knw the anand we experience when we experiencing the shaking/fits. Why don't you come again and address your questions to bhai ajit singh and he will be happy to answer them openly in the sangat.

you claim to be part of the khalsa panth yet you havent even gone into his desh.

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firstly did this mahapursh tell you the sant marg as described per gurbani, and did he tell u the rasta to vaheguru as per bani: poocho santo mera thakur caasa, secondly the 'fit' as you describe it can easily be controlled, you just have to knw the jugti, and as i stated b4 u get even more anand.

Since ive been attending the sangat never has an incident occured where the sangat or bhai ajit singh ever made others feel over numbered, this isnt some dera where some 'mahapursh' sits in a seperate room and ppl touch his feet, this is sach the parachaar every1 is welcome and any1 can openly ask any question as long as its naam and gurbani related only.

you are talking of other gursikhs leaving there bodies, but what about your self? Are you drinking amrit, hearing anhad shabads, doing darshan of saach. I don't believe myself to be higher then any1 else, infact im still at early 'stages' of abhyaas hence the shaking.

I would like to know where you are getting this information from about the shaking being a stage of naam.

^ if you use your logic, we were all japping gurmanter yes? not some other manter but 'vaheguru' gurmanter yes?

then how can you disagree that the shaking didnt occur from the abhyaas done? did you see any other method to allow this shaking to occur?

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kh@ls@ ji, in bani our gurus, bhagats gurmukhs all told there stages - from your start to finish - how to get there - jugtis on how to meet god, logically if guru nanak dev ji didnt tell NO BODY, or even bhagat kabir for example then no1 would ever knw this path, and those ppl who want to meet god really badly wouldnt be able to.

do u even knw where a mahapursh does his assan or do you judge by the chola, as a chola doesnt make a sant - status of the mind.

Sounds to me like they don't know how to do swas swas simran properly, probably too fast and improper breathing, and are hyperventilating very heavily which is causing the fits.

^^ there were no 'fits' this is his take on what happened, he didnt even ask what was happening. and as explained b4 this is when a jeev is passing through the tats and are trying to smaah into the 5th taat which helps the mind progress.

By the Gurdwara's name and the guest chatting about stages leading to the "Nij Ghar" and some "Anhad Sabd" i knew this was a cult like the Radha soami people. Only their Baba knows this secret LOL this is why they talk about these stages.

^^ firstly there is no 'baba' here, nij ghar is our true home as explained by bani and anhad shabad...anyone and everyone is able to obtain this through abhyaas, as explained above.

the lying down ...when u let go of ur body and goto the 10sm dwaar your body goes into sunn therefore u fall back.

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munjoth jee

Sri Guru Naanak Dev Jee is Waheguru. They are free from ego. We're not. Thats why we should keep our abhiyaas and kamaee gupt. I remember reading (in Bhai Rama Singh Jee's autobiography) that they were advised by a Gursikh not to disclose how much bani they read etc. Since Bhai Sahib revealed how many Sukhmani Sahibs he did each day, he could no longer do that many with ease.

Also, Gurbani tells us we should be doing simran 'aath pehar.' How is this possible if you are having a fit, or shaking uncontrollably. How do you go about your daily life?

Also what do you understand from the following tuk:

guramukh rom rom har dhhiaavai ||

Having spoken to people who attend these programs in Swindon, I have a feeling you are going to tell me this is another stage (rom rom simran). Could you possibly list all the stages with reference to Gurbani?

This whole business is very confusing.

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Sri Guru Naanak Dev Jee is Waheguru. They are free from ego. We're not. Thats why we should keep our abhiyaas and kamaee gupt.

^^ you are 100% guru nanak dev ji came with the satgurus title, and he spread this akath gyan everywhere, but he also put the duties of a sikh to a gurmukh to also spread this akath katha.

I'm not sure about bhai rama singh, but gurbani guru and books are two different things. Within sikhi we only take the gurus math(thinking) not our own or another persons. But our guru is poora not adoora. To reply to your query, i can practically tell u that from my own town when we first went...there were only 3 of us and as we did our abhyaas and progressed, with the gurus kirpa, more and more and more ppl started goin with us, infact about 16+ ppl go from my town and they are all doin abhyaas now, my own grandad did sewa at the gurdwara for 40 years and his mind wasnt filled with peace, at first he was reclutent to go but when he did he himself said 'why didnt u take me b4' - why? Because he gained peace of mind, he progressed spiritually. If we kept it all to our selves then no1 would ever know and how on earth would others get this chance to do abhyaas and meet god. Why do we share our spiritual gains? To help inspire others to walk this path.

Also, Gurbani tells us we should be doing simran 'aath pehar.' How is this possible if you are having a fit, or shaking uncontrollably. How do you go about your daily life?

^^ when ur doing simran during the day your doin it in 'sum drist' - your doing ur work with ur hands and simran with ur mind, there for your not doing simran with ik-drist where your seated and trying to go into sunn. As explained before the shaking is when one is passing the tats, there are jugtis to stop the shaking.

there are 3 stages of simran jugtis: swaas swaas, swaas giraas, and rom rom. as you go further there are different jugtis, but as i am a learner and not a teacher i am unable to teach you the jugtis.

I think the main concern here is the 'shaking' as many people dont understand but dont enquire as to why its happening, then come to there own conclusions rather then finding out from either the people who experience the anand or ask bhai ajit singh.

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