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[Guest mehtab]

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

saadh sangat jee, moorakh daas was listening to proud to be sikh shabad kirtan radio 1 last night, ummm...it was like between 11:30 pm - 11:45 pm here in oklahoma...add 1 hour for new york and toronto, and deduct 2 hours for california...well its not live radio so it doesnt really matter.

daas was listening to a shabad by bhai dya singh australia waale. at 1st daas was hesitant coz that bhaisaab has used words like "number" etc instead of saying shabad. but daas continued to listen coz Gurbani sung by any1 and every1 is just too awesome to miss. but at 1 point daas was shocked when bhaisaab started doing viakhia, and said "the SGGS is not logic, its spiritual" and daas cudnt take it any longer and switched on to the next shabad.

it is really surprising to know, that although white american sikhs have found full 100% logic in SGGS, our own Punjabi Sikhs still say that it is spiritual and not logical.

is it out of ignorance? or is it to avoid dodging and scientific questions from non-Sikhs by merely specifying that there is nothing scientific or logical and only spiritual?

[GABROO KHALISTAN DAH]

man has'nt this daya guy b'n proven wrong

[r.singh]

I can't comment on what he was saying, since I don't know the context. But I have to say that I've always seen Guru Granth Saahib Jee as spiritual first and foremost. Sure, there's logic and everything else too, but firstly, Guru Saahib is our spiritual guide. Our goal is to become spiritually elevated and reach god. Along the way, we may pick up logic and all the rest, but aren't those things secondary?

For example, if someone was completely ignorant of any scientific pilosophies and knew nothing about and had no interest in searching for anything logical, they could still reach great spiritual heights by going to guru saahib with complete love and devotion - childlike, innocent love. Or like the love of a dog for it's master. Logic and science would be of no concern to such a person. Of course, along the way, Guru Saahib may grant them this wisdom as well. But that wouldn't be the primary goal.

Or looking at it from the other side. If I go to Guru Saahib with primarily logic and science in mind, might I lose sight of the end goal, which is spiritual? How far would I get spiritually? Would I constantly be caught up in trying to see the logic and trying to match science and sikhi? Maybe that's what he meant, that our primary focus should be on the spiritual side.

I'm not trying to put down logical thinking or anything like that. It's good to think logically. But it's hard to even pinpoint what logic exactly is. For a religious person, belief in God is completely 'logical' but try convincing an atheist of god using purely 'logical' and scientific arguements. They'll think you're an irrationa

l lunatic. Of course, I may be completely off in my thinking. If so, please correct me.

[Pheena]

I can't comment on what he was saying, since I don't know the context. But I have to say that I've always seen Guru Granth Saahib Jee as spiritual first and foremost. Sure, there's logic and everything else too, but firstly, Guru Saahib is our spiritual guide. Our goal is to become spiritually elevated and reach god. Along the way, we may pick up logic and all the rest, but aren't those things secondary?

For example, if someone was completely ignorant of any scientific pilosophies and knew nothing about and had no interest in searching for anything logical, they could still reach great spiritual heights by going to guru saahib with complete love and devotion - childlike, innocent love. Or like the love of a dog for it's master. Logic and science would be of no concern to such a person. Of course, along the way, Guru Saahib may grant them this wisdom as well. But that wouldn't be the primary goal.

Or looking at it from the other side. If I go to Guru Saahib with primarily logic and science in mind, might I lose sight of the end goal, which is spiritual? How far would I get spiritually? Would I constantly be caught up in trying to see the logic and trying to match science and sikhi? Maybe that's what he meant, that our primary focus should be on the spiritual side.

I'm not trying to put down logical thinking or anything like that. It's good to think logically. But it's hard t

o even pinpoint what logic exactly is. For a religious person, belief in God is completely 'logical' but try convincing an atheist of god using purely 'logical' and scientific arguements. They'll think you're an irrational lunatic. Of course, I may be completely off in my thinking. If so, please correct me.

i agree.

Logic only takes you so far, and there are things that you read in the SGGS which cannot be explained by logic like GOD. If god could have been explained by Logic, the whole of world would be Heaven.

SGGS is More spiritual than Logical. You find Logic in SGGS, like Karma is Logical, for it can be explained thru rational examples. But Love cannot be understood thru Logic....it has to be felt. Words cannot describe what Love is. Silence is the answer for the question what is love.

If you look thru Spiritual eyes the SGGS is not logical. For a seeker needs a definite answer to what god is, he looks for a logical explanation. The Logic resides in the Mind, and Mind cannot Grasp the existance of God therefore God cannot be explained thru Logic. The path of spiritual practice is of simply LOVE.

Dunno i lost my train of thought....sorry if i sound confusing....

[moorakh mugadh]

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

yesterday i and rochak spoke abt it first of all HOW CAN HE SAY THIS,2ND) THE SITE SHOULD NOT ADD THIS TYPE OF THINGS

rochak bhai could u plss mail the site abt this plssss

[Jkaur]

well rochak veerji wut exactly did he mention.. if u could at least elaborate then it might be clear to all of us..

and anyway dya singh he's been to few of our annual samelans and he will always come out wid some crazy thoughts and ideas.. "like modifying the WJKK WJKF.. by making it cool by just pointing 2 fingers out ==> like dis and jz sayin fateh ... dat guy is funny.. i neva do bother listenin to him...

[Guest mehtab]

i just emailed Mr Devinder Singh Uppal, the webmaste of proudtobesikh.com

WaheGuru Ji Ka Khalsa WaheGuru Ji Ki Fateh

Bhaisahib, last night I was listening to Shabad Kirtan Radio 1 at http://www.proudtobesikh.com . I heard a shabad by Bhai Dya Singh from Australia waale. I am sorry I don't remember the title of the shabad, but i heard bhaisahib saying that the Sri Guru Granth Sahib is not logical but spiritual. Please do the needful about the shabad by either removing it from your database or anything else you think is proper, as what he has said is not obviously true.

bhul chukk maaf

WaheGuru Ji Ka Khalsa WaheGuru Ji Ki Fateh

~ Rochak

lets see what he says

[moorakh mugadh]

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

good rochak did a good sewa lets see what they answer.

[S1ngh]

Well dass malang.. this daas would advice malang daas to ignore katha's of dass dya singh and many other daas.. cauz they add their own opinions !!

SGGSJ is bot logical and spiritual !!

Ummm dya singh

@

Maybe we can go to dya singh concert and ask him...

Daas bikram singhaaa

[warrior*princess]

I have noticed from the beginning that bhai dya singh australia waale just does whatever creates 'fame' for him. THATS ALL!

AND he is big headed on the way he talks about his life or other things, that is too obvious.

So do not read into his opinions or teachings. Just leave it.

He needs to try and look and feel more spiritual/ visually like this > :e: