Question About The Rehat Maryada?

[International Akaali]

"let alone baba nand singh je, u also questioned bhai randheer singhje on another thread and then were shown u were wrong with banee thuks"

Ok in that thread no quotes from gurbani sshow that karamat (powers) are evn possible in gurbani. It was really Unbelivible to believe all those ""gurmukhs" because they all seem mysterious and weird. The meat thing has been discussed enough already i don't even want to talk about that and if you still do then tell me. You always say Taksal said this takksal said that. Tell me Where in the Taksali reyat maryada where it says "apporved by akal thakht: I went to its website and checked where the reyat maryada was based and there was nothing with akal takht on it. Taksal choses to abey a few things from Akal takht and it refuses to obey some hukamnama's from akal takht. on there site it says " A Hukamnama from Sri Akaal Takhat Sahib excommunicated Narakdharees on 30 June 1978." But when a Hukamnama from Akal takht was givin on the meat issue where no one could be excommunited for eating meat on Febuary 15 1980 they don't chose to obey that one. They only chose the ones that suit them. Taksal says whoever eats meat is not a sikh. You people make all those people i mentioned before like gurbanchan singh, randheer singh nanad singh higher then Shri Guru granth sahib ji. The reaosn why i say this is because you guys believe whatever they say and tell. But yet when The gurus left us with there bani we don't like to read. You like those stories of those people.

Bhula Chuka maf

Waheguru ji ka khalsa Waheguru ji ki fateh

[kds1980]

wjkk

wjkf

very good reply r singh ji

[Gupt daasan daas]

yo no offenc but i dunt think maskeen was anywhere near sant nand singh es avastha, or baba gurbachan singh jes, or baba ishar singh jes, or the countless other sants avastha who say no

so using maskeens aid so as a argument aint gnna hold

and ya i kno maskeen supported meat, thas y he was kicked out of malton, of course hes gonna say it

and if u want to starrt with sants, then bring it here please veer je

and if sahib singh writes something its law?

perhaps he is WRONG? as ive seen sometimes i disagree with his trnlation

r singh

karamath isnt possible?

yo seriously

im askin SERIOUSLY

have u READ guru granh sahib je?

have u READ bhai gurdaas jes vaaran?

have U READ sikhi ithihaas?

if u didnt, u really need to because they all show all types of karamths are possible, and do happen

and WHER have i use taksal as my main argument on this thread?

wat the heck, ur making no sence

ure just making up ure own stuff

if u wish to check where akal takht has said ddt maryada ok, go get the actual book witht he khalsa maryada written by sant gurbachan singh je

and u will see in it

at least i saw in the coopy i read

ill do one better for u

ill photocopy, im gettin the book to buy anyways, so ill send it to u over pm

man y the hell do u like making up lies

seriously

y u like lying

or ure reaaally confused

taksal has not said whoever eats meat is not a sikh

it recoigzes halal as kureight

but it also strongly says dont eat chatka unless in jang, etc u heard the thing

and who is mking them bigger than guru je

by them, i mean sants

guru je himself in hukamanama has ordered to stay away from meat and fish

in banee many coutles times it says dont eat meat

bhagath kabir je says he who eats meat goes to hell, becuase meat stirs up kaam and other vices

it also says many times in banee not to kill animals

the shabad posted on this very thread supports fact not to eat meat

a vegie diet is best for bhagthee

and y shud we kill somethings mother or father

man bane vaar vaar, over and over, says dont eat meat

guru jes sants say dont eat it

guru jes hukamnmai say dont eat it

but like is aid before singh sahib

u dont belive me, k

do contunius sehaj paats and take a hukamnama

w.e guru je tells u to do do tha

they kno best

bhula chuka maf

[Guest Star]

That hukamnama is false. Who said it is true? Fake hukamnama written by brahmans. Guru Gobind SIngh Ji's hukamnama says don't eat kutha mass, meaning halal. Don't tell me all Gurus preached different message. How about cooking dear at Kurukshater. How about cooking Mahaparsaad at Madho Dass dera? How about cooking meat at Anandpur and feeding it to brahmans? How about cooking it at Hardwar? How about te Lion skin at Anandpur? How about the killing of pigs as written in Bachitter Natak? You don't believe in Bachitter Natak now? How about Gurbani saying Mass Mass Kar Moorakh Jhagray. You don't have to agree with Sahib Singh. He did aarth to best of his ability as close to Gurmat as he could get. He wasn't biased. He didn't misinterpret bani. His aarths look pretty nice. He worked hard. Spent a lot of time. Taksal is on a mission to go against everything the Panth does. They are separate Panth the way they act. They never agree on any Panthic decision. They are close to Amritsar. Why don't they go to Akaal Takht and change the maryada to Taksals? Vedanti is from taksal too. Pooran Singh was from taksal too. Many granthis and employees are from taksal too. If taksal maryada is right. Why don't they put it there? Why didn't these Sant Mahapurakh with high avastha go to Akaal Takht and say this is right. They were only able to write books and talk in their deras? When taksal maryada was placed into act by Jathadaar Rode in 1987, what happened? What happened to fight for Khalistan? Did it help or did the movement die after? Let me tell you what happened and why. The movement died. It died because taksal maryada has anti-Gurmat material so Guru Ji wasn't happy. So the movement died. Try as much as you want but there will be no Khalistan until bipran kee reet isn't removed.

[proud_to_be_singhni]

i dont know of sant singh maskeenji's view on meat but he has enuf knowledge o gurbani and all other religions and science than most people and shud be compared with some of the greatest men of this yug, maskeen ji shudnt b used in petty self explanatory issues and arguments. Read gurbani peoplethe issues on meat are stated Clearly Maskeen ji's probably in the true heavenly abode as we speak, loking down and smiling at us manmukhs.

vaheguru.....rspect to MASKEEN SINGH JI, one of my idols in making me take up sikhimore deeply, a true inspiration! :wub:

{sorry if in anyoffence caused}

your sis

[International Akaali]

Gupt Dassan Dass,

I don't know where the in world you got the idea that i said the same thing maskeen said. I used my own brains ok. I am gonna start reading kabir salok. I am gonna do sa deeper study of the saloks.

Prof. Sahib singh isn't like you calm down. Hes a person who acctully studies gurbani and didnt write something that was said to him. UNlike you you put down whatever bhagat says and damdami taksal says. Tell me any toehr person who has done so much arth of bani. And its not something that is just put together in 2 years. It took him all his life. Look what HE has done for the panth but yet you people don't suggest to read and go to bhagat and listen to his Charitar stories or whatever he talks about.

Don't tell me you have read gurbani? If you have read gurbani and the arth of it you wouldve been a different person. You have to stuidy Shri guru granth sahib ji its not just whatever said in the thookk is what its meaning. Its a deeper meaning to it.

Later in another thread i will post something by one of the "SANT MAHAPURKHS" of how they have birpan kee reet. I will not tell you yet. I have to get the sources.

Malton Gurdwara is Taksal gurdwara they even keep jott and komb!!!! Don't tell me you think that right to know?

How am I lying, how am i confusing.

And yes Damdamitaksal says whoever eats Jhatka meat is not a sikh. Its in there dera maryada.

Hukka - Smoking tobacco, and all other intoxicants

Hajamat - Removing hair

Halalo - Eating meat

Haram - Adultery and sexual relationships outside of marriage

1. Hukka (tobacco and all other intoxicants) (courtsy of damdamitaksal)

And now can you answer this question: " A Hukamnama from Sri Akaal Takhat Sahib excommunicated Narakdharees on 30 June 1978." they obey this hukamnama from Akal takht.

They choose to disobey this one: Hukamnama from Akal takht was givin on the meat issue where no one could be excommunited for eating meat on Febuary 15 1980.

why is it so. Its becauser they think there right and AKAL TAKHT is wrong.

Bhul Chuk Maf

Waheguru ji ka khalsa Waheguru ji ki fateh

[Niranjana]

I saw this and it reminded me of another thread I saw on the Tapoban Forum:

http://www.tapoban.org/phorum/read.php?f=1&i=43165&t=43165

Near the bottom, there is the following statement:

The Rehit Maryada as issued by the Damdami Taksal (see http://www.damdamitaksal.com/rehat.pdf) the following lines from Bhai Gurdas Jee:

"Be faithful to your one wife, see others as your daughters and sisters, (for women you must be faithful to one husband and see others as your sons and brothers)." (//. 6, Pauri 8, Bhai Gurdas Jee)

are interpreted as follows:

A Singh must look upon his wife as his faithful Singhni and a SINGHNI SHOULD LOOK UPON HER HUSBAND AS PARMESHWAR(GOD).

This is not unique only to DDT, Nanaksar also adopt the same advice as do the Nishkam Sevak Jatha. Please tell me if this is not Bipran ki Reet and a direct quotation of the “Pati-Parmeshvar” ideology of the “Hindus”?

[WGJKKWGJKF]

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji KI Fateh.

I would just like to say one thing the Gurbani is clear on everything it says. N the rehat Maryadas were made after the times of the Gurus (i think) n i think the 'normal rehit maryada' the one which we follow today was made in 1945. N the fact that the rehat maryada was made after the times of the Gurus also means that the scholors could of made a mistake in understanding the Gurbani.

Im saying this because of the fact that the rehit maryada says were allowed to eat meat, when were not.

READ BELOW OR CLICK ON THIS LINK TO SEE THE FULL VERSION OF THIS ARTICLE WHICH EXPLAINS THAT WERE NOT ALLOWED TO EAT MEAT.

http://www.akj.org.uk/literature/article.a...gurmat&f=srm04a

Heres some main point i copied n pasted from the article:

.

Kapur Singh rightly points out "Sikhism is not a religion of confusion and tomfoolery.'115 The Sikh Way of Life is based upon the highest principle of Divinity -with the ultimate goal of merging one's soul (Atma) with the Ultimate Soul (Param-Atma).

In Gurbani the word "Kuthha" as well as "Kohna" have been used at a number of places in this sense:

Paap Karendar Sarpar Muthey.

Ajraeel Pharrey Phar KUTHHEY. (pg. 1019)

The sinner will certainly be ruined or destroyed.

The angel of death will seize and kill them.

(Here the word "kuthhey" means simply killing, not killing by Halaal)

Bed Parhey Mukh Mitthee Baani

Jeeaan KUHAT Na Sangey Paraanee. (pg. 201)

He (Pandit) recites the Vedas very sweetly,

but he does not hesitate to kill life.

Abhakhya Ka KUIHHA Bakra Khanaa

Choukay Upar Kisey Na Jaanaa. (pg. 472)

They eat the meat obtained while uttering the unspeakable word (referring to Qalima of the Muslims which the Hindus considered as unspeakable) and allow none to enter their kitchen square.

The supporters of the word Kuthha to mean Halaal meat very often bank upon the above cited couplet to support their contention. They ascribe it to mean the meat obtained by slaying goats while uttering Qalima, which is the Muslim way of slaughtering animals. If the word Kutliha were to mean Halaal meat, the use of the word abhakhya is superfluous. The sentence should have been simply Kuthha Khaanaa to mean the eating of the Halaal meat. The very fact that the word Kuthha has been qualified with the adjective abhakhya kaa means that Kuthha refers to simple meat of the killed animal, irrespective of the method of slaying the animal; and while qualifying meat to mean Halaal, the words abhakhya kaa had to be particularly prefixed to convey that sense. Almost all the renowned commentators and translators of Sri Guru Granth Sahib, e.g., Bhai Sahib Vir Singh, Professor Sahib Singh, S. Manmohan Singh, etc., have interpreted this couplet in this way.

It is thus clear that the word Kuthha means simply meat of the killed animal and does not go into the detail of how the animal is killed. Like so many other adulterations committed by the anti-Sikhs in Gurmat Rahit Maryada, this interpretation of the word Kuthha to mean Halaal meat has also been initiated and popularized by those very anti­Sikhs, in their efforts to destroy the roots of the new faith in order to decrease its efficacy and create doubts and dissensions in the Panth. Our brothers have unconsciously fallen in their trap.

The only hymn in the whole of Sri Guru Granth Sahib that is specifically cited in support of eating meat is the hymn of Sahib Sri Guru Nanak Dcv Ji in the // of Raag Malhar on pages 1289-90 beginning with the couplet:

Maas Maas Kar Moorakh Jhaghrrey.

Gian dhian Nahin Jaaney.

Kaun Maas Kaun Saag Kahaavey

Kis Mah Paap Samaaney. (pg. 1289-1290)

Only the fool quarrels over the question of eating or not eating of the meat. He does not have the True Wisdom. Without True Wisdom or Meditation, he harps on which is flesh and which is not flesh and which food is sinful and which is not.

A deeper study of the whole hymn brings out:

Herein, Guru Sahib is addressing a Vaishnav Pandit who believes that he can achieve his spiritual goal only by avoiding meat as food and not trying to obtain the true wisdom through meditation. He has stressed that only avoiding meat will not lead one to the achievement of Spiritual Bliss if one does not do Naam-Simran. This equally applies to all, including non-meat-eating Sikhs.

It relates to the flesh or meat in general and not to any particular type of flesh - whether prepared by Halaal or Jhatka method. The Sikh supporters of flesh eating do not accept at all the intake of all types of meat, but according to them, only Jhatka meat is permissible and Halaal is totally prohibited. In other words, what does the term "Kuthha" denote?

The flesh of the mother's womb wherein the human body is born, the flesh of the mother's breasts which feed the infant, the flesh of the tongue, ears, mouth, etc., used for perception of various senses of the body, the flesh in the form of wife and off-springs referred to in the Shabad, is flesh no doubt and one cannot escape it, but is it the flesh to be eaten as food by the humans? Does the love for this type of flesh involve any cruelty or slaughter of living bodies? Obviously, the Shabad has a deeper meaning telling Vaishnav pandits that merely escaping from the flesh does not take one anywhere. Nor can anyone get rid of the flesh (i.e., attainment of salvation from the cycle of birth and death) by his own futile efforts without the Grace of the True Guru.

One very well known Sikh writer, in his book on Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji's life16, while claiming that the above hymn supports meat eating, recommends that those Sikhs who seek spiritual bliss through Naam Simran should shun it! Well, devoid of Naam Slmran Sikhism is reduced to naught.

At this point it would be worth mentioning two well known anecdotes from the life of Sahib Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji in this respect:

During his visit to Lahore, Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji happened to stay in the neighborhood of a big slaughter house. In the ambrosial hours of the early morning, he heard loud shrills and cries of the animals being butchered there. Then, in the daytime, he saw the population addicted to vices connected with meat, wine and women. He was so moved by this sight that he exclaimed:

Lahore shahar zahar kahar sawa pahar. (pg. 1412)

God's curse is upon the city of Lahore for a quarter of the day.

Duni Chand was holding a grand annual feast to feed the Brahmins in celebration of Saraadh ceremony for the peace of his departed father's soul. Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji told him that his father had taken the body of a wolf and was starving on the nearby river bank at that time. Duni Chand immediately went there and saw the starving wolf. On seeing his son, the wolf died and thus spoke to him from his Astral or luminous body:

"In human body when I was nearing death, I smelt the flavor of meat being cooked in the neighboring house and felt an ardent desire for it. I died in the same state of mind. That is why I was given the body of a wolf so that I could fulfill my last desire in human life."17

Gurbani also says:

Jit Laago Man Baasna,

Ant Saaee PragtaanL (pg. 267)

The desire to which the mind is attached,

becomes manifest in the end.

This brings out clearly the thinking of Sahib Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji in this respect. Sri Guru Granth Sahib prohibits eating of animal flesh in clearcut and unambiguous language in a number of places:

Jee Badhoh So Dharam Kar ThaapohAdharam Kaho Kat Bhai.

Aapas Ko Munwar Kar Thaapoh, Kaa Ko Kaho Kasaaee. (pg. 1103)

You kill animals and call it religion (Rahit); then what indeed is irreligion (Kurahit)?

Even then you consider yourself as a sage of sages; then whom to call a butcher?

Bed Kateb Kaho Mat Jhoothhay, Jhoothhaa Jo Na Bichaarey.

Jo Sabh Meh Ek Khudal Kahat Ho,To Kio Murghi Maarey. (pg. 1350)

Do not call various religious texts false. False is one who gives no thought

to their contents. If you consider God is in all, then why you slaughter the

chicken (i.e., life?)

[Gupt daasan daas]

nic post from akj.com

yo randeep singh

first of allt he singh sahib thing in my post was towards another post, not ures

it had nothing to do with u

and star shud just use his real id, no need to hide, we all kno who u r

u need to go and read more actual books from taksal, not just surf the net and see wat it says

taksal says halal is kureight

but says u still shudnt eat chatka unless there is dharam yudh, no food, etc.

and AKA TAKHT HAS CERTIFIED DAMDAMI TAKSAL AMRYADA

taksal has been certifid by akal takht, its oinly idiots on internet psting crap

u seriously need to gt off internet and go read banee, and actual books printed by sant je, and see wat taksal says are 4 kureights

y not listen to sant kartaar singh jes katha on i kirtan on 4 bujjar kureight and see wa they say

banee vaar vaar says meat i wrong

check tapoban.org for many articles on this

and when they heck did this turn on taksal?

this topic was on jo rath peevhi

and just like wa missionaries do, one someone actually counters there arguments, they change to something else thas stupid

before opening ure big mouth u shud be careful of wat ure gonna say

taksal has done enough for the panth

once u do wat it has done then u can talk

but u havnt done jack except go on internet and talk crap, and baseless lies

and if u keep on opneing ure mouth for nindya of taksal, which i dunt kno WHERE taksal came into fromt his whole topic or wher i use taksal said so as an argument, but if u keep on saying crap u better be ready to back up wat ure saying in real life

u critice which is eazsy to do

but y dont u try to even do 1/4 of the seva taksal has done for the panth

u forget al the shaheedis its given?

allt he parchaars its done?

the millions that have took amrit?

the santhia on gurbanee?

the parchaar agasint gov?

who the heck r u to questin taksal

wat have u done for the panth, aside form sit behhing a computer and talk crap about a panthic orginazation

u live in tronto

if u really wanna ask questions

theres enough taksalees around

y dont u go straight to bhagath je and ask?

y dontu go to joth prkash and ask the singhs there from taksal?

y do u talk crap on internet?

y dont u really go to the singhs

ure in tornto, where theere are more than enough taksali singhs

go and ask ANYTIME

bhula chuka maf

[Gupt daasan daas]

In hukumnamas collected by Dr. Ganda Singh jee and published in his book "hukumnamas" each one of Satguru Hargobind Sahib's hukumnamas state "guru guru japna janam savar sangat dee kamnaa guru pooree karraygaa. Sangatee da ruzgaar hog, ik daasee rahinaa. Maas muchee day naray nahee avanaa." Please examine the last line. Clearly it says not to even go near meat or fish. This can't be just a hoax because all hukumnamas collected issued from Satguru jee bear this order.

Bhai Gurdas jee, whose banee was called the key to SGGS by Satguru Arjun dev jee says:

Sheeh pajooti Bakkari, maradi hoie harh harh hassi, Ak Dhatura khadian kuh kuh khal ukhal vinassi, Maas Khan gal wad ke, haal tinada kaun hovassi. (Vaar 25-7)

Means the goat says, "I was eating Ak and Dhatura plants (weed plants found in India) for whole of my life, to which no body else liked to eat. And even then I am being brutally killed and my skin being ripped, What will happen to those who cut my throat and eat my meat?

At some other place, Bhai Sahib talks about goat being cut by butcher to be eaten :

"kuhe Kassai Bakkari, lai loon seekh mass proyia" Hass hass bole kuhidi, khade ak haal eh hoyia, Maas khan gal churi de, haal tinada kaun aloyia" (Vaar 37-21)

Means: Goat is being killed, cut into pieces and salt being spread on the pieces. While being killed goat says this all happened to me while I was just eating Ak plant (weed found in India's desert fields). In last line goat puts a question, what will be the fate of those in the court of god who cut my throat with a knife and eat my meat?

Bhai Gurdas Ji in Vaar 31 gives strong warning against eating meat. He said, due to some good doings in previous births, Pootna (a witch who tried to poison Krishna Ji) was forgiven. But don't take it as that act of poisoning others is acceptable. And due to some pious acts in previous births and grace of Lord, Sadhana the butcher was forgiven (there is mention about him in Gurubani too, later on he became bhagat). But it should not be interpreted as, that killing animals and eating their meat (word "Bhanga" here) is acceptable. Please read the following lines of Bhai Sahib Ji:

"Jekar udhari pootna, Wihu pialan kam na changa, Je Kassai udharia, jeean ghai na khaiye Bhanga" (Vaar 31-5)

(Thanks to www.panthkhalsa.org for these quotes).

In SGGS banee which none of us can deny, there are also lots of tuks that say it is important not to eat meat. "Kabeer, jee jo maraahi jor kar, kahitay hai jo halal. Daftar daee jab kaid hai, hoigaa koun havaal" Meaning, those that used force and kill and call it halal, after going to the court of god, what will be their state? Here it may be argued that this tuk relates to halal, but think about it. Isn't force used in killing any animal for meat? Banee says "Parthai saakhee mahaa purakh bolday, saanjhee sagal jhaanai" meaning, what mahaapurakhs say applies to all, not just who they are specifically talking too. Here this line is addressed to Muslims, but it also applies too all who eat meat. . "Kabeer joree keeay julm hai, khaitaa naao halaal. Daftar laykhaa mangeeay tab hoigo koun havaal". Also, "Kabeer, jor keeaa so jolm hai, lay jabaab khudai. Daftar lykhaa neeksai mar muhai mohai khaii” meaning it is evil to use force and kill, god will certainly take you to task for it. When you must present your deeds in the court of god, you will face blows to the face. And "kabeer, bhaang maachulee suraapaan, jo jo praanee khai, teerath barat naym keeayai sabhai rasaatal jai” here Kabeer jee clearly states eating meat, fish and liqour is wrong and religion is not possible while eating these. "Bayd katayb kaho mat jhootay, jhoota jo na bichaarai. jo sabh mai eayk khudai kahit ho, to kio murgee maarai." meaning, the Semitic and Hindu scriptures aren't false, false is he who does not reflect on them. If they say that there is god in all, then why do you kill a chicken? Finally, Bhagat Kabeer jee says "Kabeer, khoob khaanaa kheechree jaa maih amrit loan. Hayraa rotee kaarnay galaa kutaavai koun” meaning it is good to eat kicharee (mixture of rice and pulses), that has been tastefully prepared with salt. Who should risk having their throat cut (in the after life) just for a meal of meat and bread?

Mercy is of utmost importance in gurmat "daya jaanai jee kee kich pun daan karai" from aasaa dee vaar tells us to have mercy on all living things. Guru jee also tells us "dookh naa dayee kisai jee, pat sio ghar jaavo" give pain to no living thing. go home with honour. Athsath teerath sagal punn jeey dayaa parwaan: Going to the 78 places of pilgrimage, of greater merit and acceptance is having mercy upon living things.

I could give hundreds of tuks on the importance of mercy in gurmat. There is no mercy in killing an animal if there are hundreds of other things we can eat. Plants feel no pain, they don't move or squirm when we harvest them. I know a screaming goat can feel the pain when I kill it. Plants have no nervous system. Plants are a life form that can't feel pain. Animals are not as such. Many brothers/sisters may say that Maas Maas kar moorakh jhagray shabad makes meat ok. No. This shabad tells the sanyaasees that vegetarianism is not a religion. It will not bring muktee. It criticises those who wish to call vegetarianism the greatest religion. I could translate this shabad and show this, but I'll leave it for now. If someone wants though, I would be happy to translate all shabads that meat eaters want to use for support and show that they don't even begin to support meat. I hope I haven’t hurt anyone's feelings and just wish everyone would be brave to find the truth and then accept it.

bhuls chuka maf