Panj Piyareeaa instead of Panj Piyaray

[Balait_da_Sher]

N30 Veer u know as well as i know, Common Woman had to follow watever the men said. So its very unlikely they wud have allowed their women to become Panj piyariyas.

But can u explain wat Guru Maryada is?

[Hari]

Each time Sacche Patshah Guru Gobind Singh asked for a head on Baisakhi 1699, only men stood up to voluntarily offer their heads, no women stood up.Five men, hence Guru-Khalsa = five Amritdhari men.

Five Amritdhari women is not Guru-Khalsa.This is not a sexism issue, you can make it into one if you want to.

[Akaali]

Waheguru ji ka khalsa, Waheguru ji ki fateh!

Yea Hari made a valid point!! Its not a sexism issue, you can make it that if you want.

It doesn't matter if the society has evolved so much, and in some cases women exceed men, but who are you to say women should be the panj pyaray. Guru sahib, gave a hukam, and we are mere keeday (insects) of Guru sahib, how can we even think about changing/altering his command?

Ok look, Guru Nanak Dev ji maharaj already claimed Women are equal to Men, then if the women in Sikhi at the time of Guru Gobind Singh ji know all this why didn't they stand up and say women are equal to man, according to the founder of this religion, and I want to be one of the panj pyaray.

I understand women/men are equal partners and equal family members in the khalsa family, BUT the authority to give amrit to someone else only holds in the 'PANJ PYARAY' not the 'PANJ PYARIYA'.

Bhul chuk maaf jee!!

I'm a mere fool~~ :umm: @

Waheguru ji ka khalsa, Waheguru ji ki fateh!

[kam1825]

Waheguru Jee Ka Khalsa Waheguru Kee Fatah

I think if a woman had offered her head as the Guru asked we may be looking at a different story. However Hukam is huKam. I know is it the Guru's Hukam and we are to be bound by it.

For the fact of showing the sangat proof is astonishing. You speak like those without any faith who say show me God and then i shall follow. This shouldn't be the case in Sikhi.

These issues have onl come up in the last 50 years thanks to civil rights movements. Remember the roots of Sikhism are deep and these things should not be ripped apart due to what a person thinks. We are all susceptable to temptation and unless you have gian you will get things wrong so i think we should all continue with the path that the Guru showed us.

I hope i have not caused any one any offence

Kamalpreet Singh Pardeshi

Waheguru Jee Ka Khalsa Waheguru Jee Kee Fatah

[me moorakh mugadh]

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

i agree with khalsa veer,n30 veer and hari veer this is not a sexism issue,but just hukam of guru sahib and veer we should follow it bhul chuk maaf

[Balait_da_Sher]

Waheguru ji ka khalsa, Waheguru ji ki fateh!

Yea Hari made a valid point!! Its not a sexism issue, you can make it that if you want.

It doesn't matter if the society has evolved so much, and in some cases women exceed men, but who are you to say women should be the panj pyaray. Guru sahib, gave a hukam, and we are mere keeday (insects) of Guru sahib, how can we even think about changing/altering his command? 

Leh, All u guys keep going on about Guru ji's Hukam, Can u tell me What Hukam, please?

This is definatly a sexism issue, i don't think it is Guru ji's Hukam its more to do with Punjabi thinking. :umm:

how can we even think about changing/altering his command?

Hunji, keri command :umm:

[kam1825]

Waheguru Jee Ka Khalsa Waheguru Jee Kee Fatah

Amardeep Singh,

I can see you are very passionate about this issue. Now i hate being called a sexist because i honestly believe i am not but God knows better then me. If we are to change and have females initiate the amrit sanchiar we will become like the Christians in the way that the religion will split in two. We already have enough problems trying to control the faith and become one. These issues are what create discontent in the minds of people as we have seen with the Groups like the Turana Dal and Bhudda Dal. We have Nihangs and AKJs. We have Namdharis and Nirinkaris.

We are going to split again. The way the guru initiated it. So it should stay. If this was the case that females would be allowed to give out amrit. Surely it would have been in the Bandgi Nama or a Hukam nama during the times of the guru written by the great souls of the ages like Bhai Nand Lal Singh. Remember Satguru Gobind Singh Jee still was with the panth for 9 years.

After Guru Jee had gone Mata Sahib Kaur gave out Hukam Namas to Baba Binod Singh she could have mentioned this issue then if it was allowed but it wasn't. It seems to be a taboo to even think about changing what the guru started.

Kamalpreet Singh Pardeshi

Waheguru jee Ka Khalsa Waheguru Jee Kee Fatah

[Akaali]

Amar,

Guru Gobind Singh ji initiated the Khalsa, his hukam is that the panj pyaray will be the only ones to give amrit to singhs/kaurs. He didn't say 'Panj pyareea', so we need to take it as his hukam, because that is what he said. IF HE SAID MY 5 KHALSA CAN GIVE AMRIT to anyone, then it could be females, males, youth, whoever BUT BUT, he said my panj pyaray

When you take amrit, you will know! :umm:

[Akaali]

lol

Bro, you're getting a little out of context here..hahah..

Ban women from Sikhi altogether?????? LOL, that was just stupid, bro no-one here is trying to put women down, all the posts were clearly stated that women and men are equal no difference...If you understand the meaninng of 'PANJ PYARAY' then you would understand!

[Gupt_Singh]

lol i no wot it means but it was called the pyare becuz they were all men

please describe why women are incapable of giving amrit.

dont say "it was gurus hukam" because everything in sikhi is based on logic. since guruji never explicitly said women cant give amrit, if there is no logical reason then it is just dogma!

also, please give me a historical source which shows that women took amrit. if u cant, then shall we assume that women cant take amrit at all?

sikhi is a modern religion. it is based on gender equality. if a women is spiritually able, the only reason u are stopping her giving amrit is because u are sexist.

any penjis here who want to comment?