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I think he is just very young, angry and confused. A lot of people go through it.

I don't think you can read properly. No one said to stop reading bani. The post just made the point that an Amritdhari following nitnem rehat without following the whole martial/military philosophy/tradition that is also embedded in puratan rehat and Khalsa lifestyle is living incomplete. Essentially, they are living a sehajdhari lifestyle themselves.

Some people just have a severe case of selective reading. Reaching THAT far to make a false accusation is a lack of intelligence. Or he is one hell of a troll.

I've always felt an affinity for Romani gypsies. It all makes sense now. I've finally found my people. *wipes tears from eyes*

Gosh. The way some amritdharis go on its like they believe the stalk dropped them off today etc families. Sehjdhari Sikhs and moneh have been replenishing the Khalsa stock for centuries. What a way to side line majority of the panth. why do some amritdharis act like they are gods gifts? So much ego and anger towards non Khalsa...is that what your panj pyare and parents taught you ?

Who you on about? Is the name "Moni da putt?" Or "This guy?" - which guy?

Good analysis. I think Germany and France are pretty much finished. Along with them you can add Sweden, Belgium and Holland. Holland had a chance to put up even the semblance of a fight back but that finished when Geert Wilders lost the election. Same with France, that Macron guy is Jeremy Corbyn in a suit. It is ironic that the descendants of Charles Martel the warrior who stopped Islam in its tracks in the 8th century may be the first ones to fall to Islam in the 21st century. How a nation that was on the forefront of the Crusades and once challenged Britain for world domination can now suffer a terrorist attack from the religion of 'peace' almost weekly and yet vote in a Islamophile Macron is beyond me. Britain can still overcome the Islamic onslaught because of Brexit. They can at least control their borders.

dairy, saag , and wheat

It has a lot to do with diet. Punjabis eat wheat and those of smaller stature tend to eat rice as a staple. That's why Bengalis, Thais and Burmese tend to be shorter. Also genetics may also come into play especially as the ancestors of the Punjabis are thought to have come the steppes of Central Asia.

Guest Gupt Jee, the pain we feel usually is due to our attachments to maya. The Bani clearly tells us: kis naal kijeeyey dostee, sab jag chalan haar. Also, Ekas bin sabh dandh hae. It is our spiritual ignorance, which pushes us after the impermanent and perishable, thus our pains, our affliction. On the other side, Guru Sahiban, tell us to love and devote the only One, Wahiguru Akal Purukh, the source of all permanent Anand, everlasting union with Satnam, and pure Chit. Be thankful to Him, for pointing you, though through painful experience, what to look for in life, and where to head towards. You see, all relations in this creation, whether you put effort or not, will surely come automatically, as we have karmic settings with them, still then, under all circumstances, keep your mind on Pyara Preetam Wahiguru Akal Purukh. God bless you. Sat Sree Akal.

How did Punjabis gain the traits of being tall and athletic (gabroo, jwaan, etc)? I can't imagine it was a quirk of nature considering the difference between us and other Indian ethnicities such as Gujaratis, Tamils, etc.

Culture works both ways. All migrant communities are influenced by the host countries as well. These type of articles play an underhanded game where it's message to say that there is no such thing as British culture and is really a hotch potch of other cultures.

I know we had irish travellers in our school for a summer , they moved on ...but the Roma I have seen look punjabi/rajasthani and have similar mannerisms , wear long ghaggras there are some in Ilford

Personally as a young woman i always contribute to the household. It is a core value for me to contribute to the place youre living in... i dont think there is anything wrong with it my parents provided for me with much care and love so the fact that i pay towards the house is the least i could do for being born! :-) Wjkk wjkf

Dear Guest Guest1212, fllowing are 4 personal answers to your above 4 points: 1) The only feeling that one should have during that of spiritual /bhakti moments, should be like when a lover goes to meet and being in the company of the beloved, with full of joy and enthusiasm, in our case with Guru Jee and Wahiguru Akal Purukh. 2) The fact that one engages in His bhakti, should be more than any other motivations. For He is the only Sach, rest is all koor. He is unseen yet, still He is the only permanent eternal Truth, Evrything else is seen, yet it is all maya, koor. Be thankful to Him, for putting in you, even the thoughts of worshipping Him. Brother you have so much grace, bakshish on you, what else motivation do you need? 3) That time will also come. For example you want to look your face in a pond, where there the water is muddy and has waves, naturally you can not; for that you have to wait, so that the water calms and becomes waveless, and the mud goes to the bottom of the pond, then only, you will be able to see your face, in those waters... In a similar way, our sins are countless, are akhoot, there is no such cleanser in the triloki creation which can erase them, except, for His Day Meher, His kirpa, His bakshish, which will purify us duely, but for that, we have to stay at the doors of His Darbar, as kookars, come whatever it may, be ups or downs, there is no other " thao"... 4) Our duty is to stay engaged in His bhakti, without analyzing. The moment we analyze anything, the mind enters into action by calculations, by sensations, then we loose our force, our concentration, our focus on Him. The purpose of His bhakti, is to becme mindless, thoughtless, for it is our mind, the barrier between Him and us. The moment you pay attention, with fully concentrated bhakti, then brother, there is no force in the whole creation, which can stop you from getting pulled towards Him by His love, and prevent you of having His darshan. Have faith in Him, no matter if it is our last breath, even then, that is more worthy, then any other karam, for you are giving/surrendering yourself to Him, and none other. That is all what bhakti is about: love, faith, preseverence. God bless you. Sat Sree Akal.

You seriously need to check your language and attitude. Your acting like a school kid with a foul mouth that needs rinsing with large bar of soap for your own good. So your saying we should not aspire to move to bigger and better areas and improve ourselves. Just so you can fufill your hunger at cheap chicken and chip shops and shisha lounges. Good luck with representing east london from your computer. You keyboard warrior wannabe thug. p.s there is a difference between 'running away from muslims' and simply moving to a better area that has better schools and houses. Maybe you are just jealous of others because you are still stuck where you are while others have become more succesfull and moved on. Sounds like sour grapes to me.

No one is running away. Just because you might like living outside a mosque were you can hear the call to prayer. Dont think others want the same. I chose to live in an area away from muslims because I dont get on with them or see them as friends. They see all non muslims as infidels so why do you want to mix with them. In buisness and in life. I chose to not to mix with the <banned word filter activated>. They dont want to mix with anyone apart from muslims themselves anyway. That is the way it is and that is the way it will always be.

i dunno when we moved to hoxton in 75 it felt like newbury back in 99 meaning not overrun with scroungers, musley and the like most of the estate was white working class with real work ethics a few asian families , a few caribeeaan, a few african. The white working class hated dole scroungers with a venegence , a lot of them bought their homes in 80s and stayed therone up until now. We were a recognised family and still are in the old neighbourhood. They were the type to shop their own if they turned bad, and regularly poured scorn on the dole guys who would drive the latest jags and beemers to the dole office and get out looking like they were beggars for officers. some had history in the location and had family businesses like a proper village. when the balance changed because of new immigrants from bagladesh, nigeria, gambia, pakistan it changed the closeness yeah I guess a few whiteys were put out and up sticks ,but most stayed and their kids moved on

It it tought paji. But only you can find the lesson to be learned from this. Everyone has their first 'love' if not love then infatuationor 'crush' that they never forget even myself but life doesn't stop becuase someone has left you... it keeps going on and maybe it is an indicatiom that you too should move forward. There wil always be something that reminds you of her but maybe it is time to have new memories of you're own WJKK WJKF

stop right there , I was born in newham , lived in poplar until about six years we moved to a larger flat in Hoxton, Hackney, lived in Bethnal Green now Newbury Park ALL of those are considered East London because that's where they are, granted Newbury is Greater London , parts of Hoxton were N1 but they were nowhere near the north Islington etc .my street we lived on n1 and other side was E2...

A solution is, if amrit-dharis followed rehit, IF, then, only then more people might want to be Singhs. When I say rehit, I don't mean just the paper rehit maryada people have now. I mean following the active lifestyle rehit like in the rehitnaamas, rehit that has been followed since Guru Hargobind. Doing things like learning archery, shooting, horse-riding etc Follow Gurus hukam of learning shastar everyday, and also learn martial arts. (See Nihang Singh dals for example) Instead of being people that religiously follow football and cricket matches, they would be involved in these activities. Then they would be an actual "practising" amrit dhari, as opposed to someone who took amrit just to do paat, which any sehajdhari or "mona" can actually do! Can gurdwaras and sikh associations organise such activities? Organising kabaddi tournaments isn't really going to make sangat proper amrit dharis. However, organising kabaddi and wrestling training for sangat to be involved in would help! WE absolutely should not act like the disarmed sikhs of colonial times. Instead of becoming like the naamdharis who put the kirpaan symbol in the kanga, we should get out of this colonial compromise of not following martial rehit and get back to actually being Singhs. Can the community do this?

This man passed away he, his son and daughter in law were acting like God's gift. During family gathering/ prayer session at their house the old man literally frowned on seeing monehs. Daughter in law n his son spoke to everyone equally, but they forced others into keeping hair/ take Amrit. Not sure about my dad but my mum got compelled by the daughter's words n took Amrit. She was never happy kno wha am saying? Even today she speaks of leaving Amrit behind. I was a kid then never knew reasons why mum took Amrit. Anyways, the old man? Majority of his grandson's are moneh! When he died they all cut their hair. And his eldest granddaughter?? MARRIED A WHITE MAN KEEPS BOY'S HAIRSTYLE!!! (Daughter of his daughter in law)... SANGAT JIO! something to think about, why force/ compel n pester others? THEY ARE ADULTS AND KNOW ABOUT AMRIT/ PRAYERS!

Why are you making this about amritdharis supposedly believing they are superior? Amritdharis have nothing to do with it. Moneh go out of their way to discard their Sikh identity. Did amritdharis make them do that? Moneh are able to decide weather they wanted to outwardly identify as Sikhs, and they are apparently ashamed of looking like Sikhs since they opt not to. Finally, I am tired of moneh complaining about amritdharis discriminating against them. Yes, some amritdharis behave poorly. But moneh outnumber amritdharis 99 to 1. So why on earth do moneh act like they are some sort of persecuted minority?

This is all cyclic. Once any actual fighting has to be done (in the UK at least), they'll quickly lose their arrogance and act like best pals. What is weird though is that indifference between sehajdharis and amritdharis has reached a level I've never witnessed before in the UK. That all being said, I have noticed apnay (keshdharis and amritdharis) going out of their way to acknowledge me in the last few weeks in London. I think many with brains can sense that things might kick off and know they are vastly outnumbered on all sides - so they'd better get all the help they can. Maybe the majority of the snide, resenting type of amritdhari reside on the internet forums as angry trolls, whilst the rest either don't give a crap about this issue or have more realistic conceptualisations of the wider community? A keshdhari boy from a not so strict family once told me that these people resent others because they feel imprisoned themselves and resent the perceived 'freedom' or laxity they think others have. If people are feeling that way about following their faith - it's sad.

What you showing your mommy? Not wise to show her how you talk to others behind a keyboard, son.

Thank you for pointing out the self enforced limits of our brothers intellect. I doubt however that other than regurgitating vacuous statements we are likely to get a personal rationale, thoughts on his opinions. I think some people don't get the idea that this forum should and could be a place to learn, be challenged a window into perspectives as individuals we haven't considered.. It's much easier to just make vacuous statements than actually search for the truth

LOL x here he is mister hate.. I feel for you brother

Hmm... I have noticed in recent activity on here, a video was shown titled "Sikh Girls behaving badly" and a 2nd link concerning this, Mrs Javeed (was it jagdeep javeed)?? The Sikh descendant married a muslim now in big brother house. If we call such women "Sikhs" and defame them like that on here then yeah, I guess we can call moneh boys Sikhs but would we defame a Sikh guy who married a non Sikh?? Then we'll say "He was a Punjabi..." It appears women did not get off lightly! First of, Javeed was just a normal non Sikh following woman, if she wore a turban/ baptised THEN we would have a problem. And what about that video showing them indian girls, partying n talking about... Bedroom stuff?? Again, all girls had NO turban, NO signs of Kara and NO signs that their names are kaur/ Sikh names. What did we do?? Post their vid on here titled "Sikh girls behaving badly..."

Poor answer in a debate, son. Explain to us difference between Sikh and Khalsa then.

It isn't, but that's rarely the narrative put forward by parchariks, kathavachiks and camp sevadars. The much more common one runs along the lines of 'these Sikhs died rather than remove a single hair, what excuse does the mona have?". It's negative reinforcement. How we treat language matters, the phrasing of a sentence is often much more decisive in convincing someone of its correctness than the intellectual merit of its contents. This assumes that amritdharis, simply by being amritdharis, are honoring the meaning of Sikhi and showing allegiance. As well as being demonstrably wrong, this is a very toxic notion - the idea that somebody in a turban is immediately believed to possess virtue in greater measure than someone with cut hair, has certainly assisted snakes-in-turbans like the badals in their rise to power (because their turbans act as a kind of political smokescreen, something to impress the rural folk who are so easily awed by the sight of a white bearded man in a dastaar). These seemingly harmless ideas can have dire consequences. If we wish to judge someone's allegiance to Sikhi we ought to look at their actions, not their roop.

What actual good is going to come of this question? There are 25 million Sikhs across the planet, as compared to the 1 billion+ adherents of Islam, Christianity, and Hinduism, all three of which harbor malicious designs against Gursikhi, and you actually wanna reduce the number of Sikhs even further. 'Sikh' and 'Singh' were never even considered to be the same thing up until very recently. Those arguing otherwise should investigate historical accounts from the era of the Sikh confederacy/empire and base their judgement on these itihaasic facts rather than 20th century prejudices. In particular the distinction between 'Khalsa' and 'Khulasa' Sikhs. Just as Sikhs are being whitewashed out of the history of India, the contributions of Sehajdhari Sikhs are also being whitewashed out of the history of the qaum.

She's quite the confused character ? or just a very transparent "undercover Hindu."

Listening on the radio and one of the worshipper was shocked because he could not believe such a thing can happen in the 21st century and during Ramadan. The cheek of the guy. Bet the Ummah was counting on the kafir to do nothing. Bet it is a shock to their system. They will keep their heads low for a while.

Bhein ji life is all about choices ! Bibi can either be homely or career oriented. Problem starts when you mix both lifestyles. Alpha females usually end up with sissy husbands or toy boys. They are also called home breakers by in-law's coz they are not wired to live in joint families.

Some Amritdhari Sikhs may wish to do chaupai sahib before taking off the kirpan and do the moolmantar or chaupai sahib again when they put it on after games/PE. Reciting this prayer is seen as a way of asking permission to take it off

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh http://www.akj.org/f...t=5732&start=15 SEVERAL singhs of naam abhyaas kamaayee, and those who attained shahid status during the turmoil of 1980's and 90's did not regard Chandi Ki Vaar as GuruKrit. *Mod Edit: Provocative comments removed*