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They have different approaches. The troublemakers (druggies, attitude problems, not listening to parents) are taken to a 5 week camp at Baru Sahib, also some of the rescued girls who were at fault, were married off to indians, who were glad to get a visa and when i asked didnt the girls mind, i was told the girls were glad for any chance at marriage after the wrong path they took in life. Also there are the innocent cases like an amritdhari girl who became friends with female muslims n they pressured her to go to a club. The girl went and her orange juice was spiked with date rape drug and the muslim girls let their male cousin take her. It took alot of prayers to locate her and then they had to break her out. Other times the girls naked pics r taken n then used to blackmail her. If she dont get scared then they tell the family, we will post these in ur gurudwara. Other times, the girl is brainwashed/blackmailed to stay with the muslims and she will lie to the police that i am happy and here with my own will. And that the family is forcing her to go back. These r the hardest cases. Sometimes black magic is involved and lots of paath is done and the girl wakes up and comes home herself. I am not affliated with SAS but have heard of these cases from someone within the organization, and others from following them on fb

http://www.sikhnet.com/news/sikh-band-wins-grammy-best-new-age-album

My two cents: Two types of people I personally give big leeway to are stand up comedians and folk singers. These people have a license to say things that critically mirror back society - the former through humour the latter through lyrics. I always see it as - in amongst all the rubbish they spout (and they undoubtedly do!), they should also bring overlooked issues that to the fore. They are just a part of the puzzle but overall anything that brings important (especially uncomfortable) issues to the fore is a good thing in my opinion. Sometimes we have to forget the messenger and focus on the message. Given our people's proclivity to ignore things or be in denial about them, it's even more important.

The problem arises when we put artists like Mann on some sort of figurative podium above everyone else. That forms some sort of expectation that they're supposed to say and do the right thing. Once we are able to tear down the mental idolatry of these individuals we won't give two hoots what these guys say nor will we feel insecure every time they do or don't do something that is questionable. We've succumbed to complaining about artists such as Mann instead of educating our youth and building our community. We're all responsible and shouldn't diffuse responsibility on others. Babbu Maan made a song about Baba Ranjit SIngh Dhadrianwale calling out how he was abusing the very respected title of Sant and Sikhi to further himself as an individual through money, but after a while Baba Ranjit SIngh Dhadrianwale must have had an epiphany and he has changed for the better - the extent only he himself knows. I know about Mann and many artists being complicit with dushts of the panth and their lack of jameer, but are we so fallen that we care so much about these artists that we feel offended every time they do something? That to me only shows a sign of weakness of having failed.

screw this Gurd-a$$ man geaza. Boy, I used to be a hardcore fan for years and I even went up and down UK with his tour back in 1990. The brit youth of that day needed the influence of any kind of Punjabi. any kind of cultural injection that could wake up some Punjabi blood in the kids. That was the reason I gave him so much respect back then. However, after my own battles with booze and doing putthay kamh, and then finally braking free from those depths of hell, I got to a stage where I started hating his guts because of his "apna Punjab hovay" song. He p**sed me off so much that I could have chopped him up if I ever saw him again. Thes geaza is a loser. He is fake and does it all for the money. On top of that, he's the biggest effin hypocrite. He may have helped some youths like me to stay more Punjabi back then, but he's done the worst since he got bigger and bigger with the apna Punjab karh di sharaab crap. The 2 most hated people in music on my blacklist is gurd's A$$ himself and the overated Drake the goddammed fake.

Good stuff! .. respect to these guys for their efforts.

This is what you do went the kurd parchaar gets to you , you go to the newest sikhs and give them Guru Pita ji's pegam:

Hope that cleared that bit up. Say what you like about Gurdas but its messed up when these type of fake videos go viral.

I agree these r problems...but there has to be a distinction between panjabi problems and sikh problems...tho yhesr days they r so entwined it hardly matters Are u saying that we let anyone claim they r sikh without following sikhi? I think we need more precise definition to define n describe ppl. Like islamists vs isis vs muslims. If u want to be a mona sikh, no idol worship, no caste n do at least mool mantar daily. If doin sewa at gurudwara, dont have eaten meat that day. If sehajdhari sikh, be vegetarian, do japji sahib n simran daily, no worshipping idos or faith in other religions. If kesdhari sikh, then the above plus rehraas sahib If amritdhari then full rehit And we shud have heirarchy, based on commitment to rehit and length of nitnem This way if someome claims to be sikh then at least they will know where they fit n there wil be some rules to follow. Also we can make caste n fanticide the two things that can make u not sikh. About the unrealistic sikhs, life and time r great teachers. The obese girls will learn to tell the truth n settle for less. As will the short girls and the uneducated boys. As time passes n they keep gettin rejected and cant find partners to their exact specifications, they will have to settle for less. Ofc this shows the materialistic ideology running through the panjabi/sikh psyche. Where wealth, looks, and status matter more than faith, values, and the environment. But as ppl learn money will not buy happiness, they will learn or their children will after having suffered. It might be too late for panjab tho.This materialistic culture has destroyed the land, the youth, and SGPC. But ppl r hopefully fed up with Badal and will make AAP win. Though most ppl r wrong to blame Badal exclusively for these conditions. And Badal is a sikh. If he had to get dirty in politics n go beg deras for votes, it dont make him nonSikh. Badal is providing wat the ppl want. In a documentary about water, it said that panjabis r using subsidized electricity to pump increasing amounts of water n decreasing water table at alarming rate. And why did Badal provide free electricity for farmers to destroy water table? Cuz farmers wanted that. Ofc the Anandpur resolution n water rights could help. But we lost that war. Noway a mere voted politician can get that concession from central govt. So if we want panjab to succeed, we need someone who doesnt only have farmers or Sikhs interests at heart. We need a wilier, dirtier politician who can get things done. Without being labeled anti sikh every other day. Maybe AAP can do that

Who does this this elevation? Only a simpleton <banned word filter activated> in my eyes. And if loads of our people are of this ilk, that's a failure of our society and it's education system. At the end of the day people have to realise the role of folk singers in pendistic societies like ours. They are artists (modern day mirasis) who need to eat too. And these days everyone (including Amritdharis) has a large appetite. So they reflect what they believe will get them patronage from the audience. Artists just reflect what people want to hear. So I say this song is a sign of success, the success of the more conscious amongst us being able to sway popular culture above banalities to reflect more pressing issues - it is a success because otherwise I can pretty much guarantee that he'd probably be singing dumb songs about drinking or how great being a farmer is, or other miscellaneous 'lover boy' and 'lover girl' antics i.e. generally stupid and pointless or outright destructive things. It's like the late Kuldeep Manak who made some deep tunes but also came out with straight fuduness like Jut ho gaya sharaabi. It's us, as the public, that should be putting discreet pressure on our folk singers to magnify the right thing. We all know (or we should by now!) that if we don't, these people will only fall back on low level populism about caste and drinking, or prancing about like a kunar or kunjaree.

I completely agree, like i said, he's an entertainer, where some people may have a moral conscious and say they won't listen to his music because of his beliefs or lifestyle they are twice as many that will overlook it. I don't know too much about who he believes in, to be honest there are plenty of singer's who probably have dubious beliefs, that's their burden to bear, at the end of the day we need to look at what positive change we can make everyday in our lives, he's released a song and will make money from it, we can debate or argue all we want but he's still cashing his pay cheque. No, but unfortunately that's the world we live in.

Surinder Singh's view on the whole Mann issue and singers

reply to his video:

He's officially recognized as writing the song and directing the video, but I'm willing to bet this is yet another case of a parent helping out a useless kid by fabricating a claim of their involvement in their work. My mother did this all the time for my little brother to help him with job applications. In any case the personalities associated with this song aren't important, the message is. The views of the child are no reflection of the views of the parents. How many kuriaan do you know of who've taken drugs or shacked up with pakis, but have old-school or even Gursikh parents?

Can't judge a father by the crimes of his son. Not saying Gurdas Mann is an angel but these sorts of comparisons have no place in a rational discussion. It would be like judging Guru Ram Das for the actions of Prithi Chand.

You can either view plus listen to Kirtan of Sukhmani Sahib Or Recite Paath along with Sangat

It is an alternative view because the class difference is still very apparent between the older uneducated generation that immigrated versus the educated wealthier lot that stay back in india. I think you're being very harsh. The sikh way of living is unique and eternal and to compare it alongside with "eastern" or "western" values is missing its uniqueness. The word "eastern values" doesn't mean much. Go to chandigarh and you'll observe it for yourself. Punjab university is about 75% of students from punjab. I noticed plenty of girls dating for benefits. They're one thing at home and another outside at home. You won't have this dichotomy when dealing with people whose parents are educated. Sadly most of the older generation in UK , Canada aren't. From your post you're most likely from UK, so I can understand where you're coming from. Though Sikhi encompasses more than a time constrained concept of eastern or western values

Certain 'Sikhs' might be backwards and unprogressive, but there absolutely nothing wrong with Sikhi.

sikh channel seem to be running a character assasination of brown sikhs lately ...they gave the news about this NEW AGE music group Yoga background LP winning an award and added something along the lines that they are better sikhs because of this ...WTH? then you got others chiming in to say yep gorey sikhs are more holy, better sikhs than desi ones . Sorry but the lack of self-worth and brainwashedness is embarassing . Many sikhs of every hue are better sikhs of the past , present and future than these dress-up guys who believe all desi sikhs are impure , ignorant , that believe Yogi Harbahajan's interpretations of sikhi (milgoba of new age, yoga, sikhi) rather than the actual Gurbani. Many dress in bana but have not had Amrit , carry on suspect behaviour (tantric yoga vids, hom havan rituals, bhut pooja) and yet claim sikhi e.g. Leo di Caprio's stepmum. Frankly I suspect that the main reason they did so well was who was backing them (South park music director) , otherwise there are thousands of Gursikhs producing massive output of high quality which also people appreciate but never get awards except in India perhaps Stop putting people on pedestals just of their colour , even just because of their worldy achievements that is nothing compared to achieving in the dharmic field : sewa, simran and Kirtan.

The video is disturbing , it should be banned.It is showing kids how to hang themselves.There are so many vunerable people out.How did it get pass the censors

You will not find any answers to your questions here.what you will find is "normal" advice. Your mind is going to be filled with a lot of dirt from this forum. You kept your hair again. Now work on the internal issues by Gurbani. No advice here will help you. They will judge you and set you on the wrong way and the result will be more depression. A lot of the "normal" people dont deal with depression as often as others and in your case. They are blinded by worldy attachments that will drag them into hell. When they do deal with episodes of depression, they cover it up by taking a worldly ways out. The worldly garbage keeps them "stable" and they live a so called balanced life of secular and religious ways. They can't help you understand what you need to do is lift yourself out of a hole you are in. Currently you feel good but it may not last long till you are facing depression again and its very hard to focus on Gurbani. You're in a vicious cycle of ups and downs at this time and life is hell. There is only one way out of it. Through Gurbani, read listen contemplate and stay in sangat who have a desire to be with Gurbani, actually live the teachings. In this way you won't be bothered by bad thoughts. Sleep with Gurbani playing as well. This will clean your subconscious of filth. Gurbani will strengthen your mind and worldly garbage will not flood your mind with trash. You need true inner strength of faith, love, compassion, contentment, and self worth. These blessings from the Guru will make your mind tough. No one here can give you these things. Listen to the teachings of sri guru granth sahib ji.

positive contribution ? bro please tell us what special thing Mann has done for anyone himself ... the things I talked about are his personal responsibility nothing about he predcessors I don't care to go that far back when the problem is in front of me . No spine , no ethics , prepared to encourage sharabi culture then a couple of years when he can feel the seachange politically then hai hai ki hoya mera Punjab nu .... really if you believe he or his ilk give two pence for sikh kaum. punjab's problems you are deluded . Very few i.e. count them on one hand actually have done anything close to make a real difference

yeah yeah we all are ...made me smile anyhoo

Interesting little newsclip. Might be a strategy for Panjab?

Bro, you know from the day I heard about his health I've had one thought going through my mind and that is that, I wish I could somehow take his cancer from him. May Maharaaj do kirpa or a chamatkaar. He is a diamond to the panth and what we as a kaum needed, especially in the UK. He woke up so many people in different parts of the world and in several ways. Truly took Dhan Guru Nanak Dev Ji's message out there. Akaal

Maaf karnaah ji , I wasn't trying to be nosey or disrespect his privacy. It was only as I heard he done a live video stream at the camp but from home and he was in my thoughts. Didn't mean to offend anyone or sound to be disrespectful. Bhuf chuk maafi, Akaal