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Bro, are you saying you havent seen that video on youtube of dhunda with his face covered hitting Jaap Sahib pothi with a stick and saying bad things about it? I was impressed by dhunda the first time I heard him speak. He made a reply to that mad woman kamlesh kamli and he gave a good response. But this is their Operus Mandi, they make themsleves out to be panthic because they get the ears of people and then they reveal their true colours. Dhunda has said that shabads more vulgar than prostitutes songs are being sung at Sri HariMandir Sahib. He said that using mala is anti-gurmat. How can it be ANTI-gurmat? He also said that stories about Guru's are made up. He said that Guru Gobind Singh broke the pots of women carrying water on their heads so their clothes would get wet. Then their clothes would stick to their bodies and you can see where he was heading with that one. he is just copying his guru dilgeer who has more or less said that every story in the guru's lives are false. dhunda was asked on video what his thoughts were about darshan rogi and his recent attempt to start a new panth in USA. He was aksed several tijmes, and his reply was "go ask them". He was too coward to give his true thoughts on it. If he was against it, like he is against so many things in Gurmat, he would have said straight away. But underneath he is the same as the other cockroaches. No, I'm offended that someone as articulate and educated as yourself say that you don't know people hate him. You know why some people hate Banda Bahadur on the evidence of 1 book written almost 200 years ago, but for the last 15 or so years these cockroach missionaries have been spreading filth and you DON'T KNOW? Come off it brother!

In one of the 52 commandments Guru Gobind Singh Ji left for the Sikhs he stated that a daughter of the Sikhs should only have her hand in marriage given to another Sikh family. But he did not say the same for Sikh sons for them only given to Sikhs for marriage. Why was this? This question is mainly for the liberal lefties to ponder on. Because to majority of learned and right thinking Sikhs he is clearly showing us how there is a difference between the genders when it comes to procreation and relationships. Sikh Men are like rocks in the ground they will usually stick to their reiligion. And Guru Ji knows the condition of men of all backgrounds are that they are tribal so its a given that sons will not let the Sikh side down. But most women are like sheep they will be lead to whatever religion their partner is a believer in. So if they are married off to non-sikhs then she will become that non-sikh and her offsping 9/10 times will be non-sikhs. For a pularistic faith like Sikhi it is especially dangerous for our demographics sake that Sikh women are raised in the belief that they only want to marry a fellow Sikh believer. We can see countless examples of non-abrahmic faith communities whose populations have been destroyed because they did not control their womens choice of partner. We can look at the kalaesh of northern pakistan who are almost extinct due to muslims converting their women and creating more muslims. We can see zoroesterian persians who had a huge mighty empire that used to invade other lands but now are no where to be found only small communities scattered around the world because muslims forced islam on them and bred with their women creating muslims only. Which is why we know muslims try their best to groom and convert kafir non-muslim women especially those who they view they are in war in to get 1 over the kufr. And if you ever seen a marriage between a girl from Sikh background to a non-sikh groom you will find most of the time the kids are born as non-sikhs. So there is no equality in nature & biology nor in Sikhi nor in most human soceities that want to exist and excel when it comes to relationships there are clear set out rules.

It takes a certain type of female to do what someone like JKV has done. Someone who isn't a sheep, and dare I say, a woman with "balls." I've noticed even younger, western born Gursikh bibiya are falling victim to the appeasement mentality, whereby they'd rather be popular and inclusive and not rock the boat, than speak the truth from a Gurmat and common sense perspective and perhaps make certain people uncomfortable.

It's a shame that JKV has not commented as I think she has proved the exception. She's a example of a Sikh woman who has married a non-Sikh and I believe has brought up her children as Sikh. Maybe more Sikh women should be like JKV.

Jassa Ji , I live in USA . Dhundha comes here. We have tried to get him agree to sit with him and bring to his attention that his preaching is basically misinterpretation of SGGS Ji. He never agreed for a vichar. You say that he knows Guru Granth sahib and preaches that.On every ang of SGGS ji guru sahib advises about nam simian.Then how come dhundha does not know that? Then why he became a preacher? For example he says there is no reincarnation. Whatever is this life only. Only fools will agree with him . Guru Granth Sahib advises about result of karmas. Should we believe him or SGGS Ji. being a wise person you will know that gurbani is not be preached only it is to be lived and experienced. Without nam simran one can never elevate spirituality and experience divine. His above video shows his level of humility. Humility is hall mark of a gurmukh. Sampardaya parcharaks spend 15 years in learning these traits. You will not find their parcharaks displaying deceit, lies and arrogance.

Please reply to my query above. This thread is not about you or others like you. This is about heretic missionaries. can you tell us how we should nam simran as Dhundha says nam simran is tota rutten. dhundha says there is no soul , karma etc. is he right ? And do not divert it this thread to sggs vs dasam Granth. Start a new thread on that and you will be taught basics of dasam Granth sahib as I have read it in totality. Have you or have you not?

bani of 10th master is a deep treasure of spirituality, a guide how to lead a life avoiding pitfalls of immorality pervading this world and tell us how we should sacrifice for welfare of humanity. only an insane devoid of compassion and humility will raise finger on such sacred writings.

How can anyone with an average IQ expect from the members of the so called Sikh 'panth' to understand, appreciate, elaborate and then propagate Sikhism when 110% of the so called 'panth' has never been blessed with reading of normal finer works of art in their lives?! If 110% of the SP has never appreciated the Pinjabi classics which is the responsibility of those that set out the national curriculum how can anyone in their right mind expect them to appreciate the SACRED literature enunciated by the SACRED Gurus? Considering most Sikhs have never had the blessing to glance at ordinary literature written for ordinary people, so to access or experience a range of emotions or events, which will enable them to increase their understanding or appreciation of different topics and concepts! I am afraid the so called 'panth'has been deprived of literacy and numeracy so badly, that it is impossible for anyone to relate to matters from someone else's point of view, which in turn has hindered the panth's ability to feel appreciation for the divine literature of the 10th King. The Bani of the 10th King, if read with utmost sincerity enables us to develop the most humane of emotions known as EMPATHY! Without this noble and virtuous quality no one with two legs, two arms and two eyes should address himself as a member of the human race. EMPATHY gives birth to higher, noble, refined, subtle and many more sacred and divine qualities in a human being. No wonder, we only ever witness them in great Mahapurushs only nowadays! If one is still questioning then one should not be questioning in public where the Guru's Sangat has congregated to learn Sikheee! Their questioning signifies their doubt in the Great Bani and the Hukams of the Most Divine Guru. They are imparting their doubt, ignorance, disbelief and arrogance to the Guru roop Sangat. It is a case of blind leading the blind and totally profane and sacriligious. These doubting Thomases, fake preachers, should not be allowed to preach to the GRSangat till they have worked out their doubts and faith in the Guru in private.

nobody needs more headcases Hehe ... honestly I did nothing just looked hard and passed the whole thing to Guru ji's hand I would have been content to be single and do sewa of panth ... if Guru ji had made it so . Angelo is more sikhi khial than your average person , a real family person who understood that being a sikh is a hard choice and doesn't let up on the kids if they try slacking . In his words 'they will be better christians as Gursikhs, because they will have structure and method to their spiritual life' . He understands our struggles in Punjab and the evil nature of GOI. He's been to Amritsar Harimandir Sahib , Dhubri Sahib , Assam , ChungThan , SIkkim he believes in Guru Sahiban .

aww what if you are like my dada ji who had ice blue eyes and reddish brown hair but pure punjabi ? according to your narrow criteria he wouldn't count or anyone like that, like my thaia ji or his eldest son , or grandson . Sikhi is from within not just without the whole picture is important including her/his family influences and personal views .

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This above is key. Absolute gold.

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Genie is right. Puraatan Singhs who chose to make their homes outside the Punjab and were confronted with the immediate problem of a lack of Sikh women, would usually marry local girls and in doing so bring them into the Sikh fold. This happened en masse with the Dakhni/Hazoori Sikhs of Maharashtra, and the Patna Sikhs of Bihar. The phenomenon is repeating itself today. Plenty of young Punjabi Sikh mundaay in the UK are marrying girls from Eastern Europe. What's more they actually take these women to the Gurdwara with them, along with any kids they have [occasionally you even see one with a little joora or patka]. I've never observed the same thing happening with a Sikh girl marrying outside the faith. If she isn't basically an atheist already, she converts to the religion of her new husband and raises her kids in the same tradition. These Sikh girls also tend not to target men from traditional, conservative and family-minded cultures like the Polish and E. Europeans, but blacks and Western Europeans whose values are very different from our own.

Acceptance should be there- yes but Contextualization/vichar is also important

Dhundha should learn these traits in his school and then start preaching. Why he is being opposed because he is a conman without knowledge of gurbani. Give me a break if someone says there is no soul and he is appreciated by a person like you. Do you believe there is no so ਬਿਰਧਿ ਭਇਆ ਜੋਬਨੁ ਤਨੁ ਖਿਸਿਆ ਕਫੁ ਕੰਠੁ ਬਿਰੂਧੋ ਨੈਨਹੁ ਨੀਰੁ ਢਰੇ ॥ He grows old, his body and youth waste away, and his throat is plugged with mucous; water flows from his eyes. ਚਰਣ ਰਹੇ ਕਰ ਕੰਪਣ ਲਾਗੇ ਸਾਕਤ ਰਾਮੁ ਨ ਰਿਦੈ ਹਰੇ ॥੭॥ चरण रहे कर क्मपण लागे साकत रामु न रिदै हरे ॥७॥ Cẖaraṇ rahe kar kampaṇ lāge sākaṯ rām na riḏai hare. ||7||He feet fail him, and his hands shake and tremble; the faithless cynic does not enshrine the Lord in his heart. ||7|| ਸੁਰਤਿ ਗਈ ਕਾਲੀ ਹੂ ਧਉਲੇ ਕਿਸੈ ਨ ਭਾਵੈ ਰਖਿਓ ਘਰੇ ॥ सुरति गई काली हू धउले किसै न भावै रखिओ घरे His intellect fails him, his black hair turns white, and no one wants to keep him in their home. ਬਿਸਰਤ ਨਾਮ ਐਸੇ ਦੋਖ ਲਾਗਹਿ ਜਮੁ ਮਾਰਿ ਸਮਾਰੇ ਨਰਕਿ ਖਰੇ ॥੮॥ बिसरत नाम ऐसे दोख लागहि जमु मारि समारे नरकि खरे ॥८॥ Bisraṯ nām aise ḏokẖ lāgėh jam mār samāre narak kẖare. ||8|| Forgetting the Naam, these are the stigmas which stick to him; the Messenger of Death beats him, and drags him to hell. ||8|| ਪੂਰਬ ਜਨਮ ਕੋ ਲੇਖੁ ਨ ਮਿਟਈ ਜਨਮਿ ਮਰੈ ਕਾ ਕਉ ਦੋਸੁ ਧਰੇ ॥ पूरब जनम को लेखु न मिटई जनमि मरै का कउ दोसु धरे ॥ The record of one's past actions cannot be erased; who else is to blame for one's birth and death?

Why not both?

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"Now in the above video posted he questioned Hemkunth Sahib with a quote from Guru Granth Sahib that which has a word to word meaning ke Paharan te sidh beth ke apna janam gawa rahe hai te guru Gobind Singh kiddan pahar te beth ke bhagti kar sakde hai. What would be its better reply to answer him based on Guru Granth sahib bani or shut him up and abuse him ?" Response jassa need to understand that in Guru Granth Sahib there is spiritualism. Dasam Granth sahib apart from spirituality has history and autobiographical parts. In Sikhism history and spiritualism go together. History is our body and bani is our soul. Dhundha was a truck driver before he did two year course of missionary. He does not understand the difference . Had he he would not done comparison. What does he know whether guru sahib was there in physical form or in subtle form.

Jassa, let us be specific instead of beating about bush. You wrote " To be short today my take on Dhunda has great knowledge of Guru Granth Sahib we have to agree with it. He speaks about social evils derawad. In one of the video he talks about show me any gurudwara dera sant baba which does ardas for baby girl. It hit me in my brain." my response Essence of Guru Granth Sahib bani is naam simran. Dhundha calls it parroting. Sikh tradition lays down procedure of nam simran and it is also given in rehat maryada. that proves Dhundha does not do nam simran. Pl tell us how he can call himself a Sikh

The first three padhs are to do with matters pertaining to maya, manmat, ignorance and unwillingness to learn anything to do with spirituality. One's reluctance to experience Waheguru Ji by accepting the Amrit and becoming Guru walle is a significant characteristic of these three padhs. Once a soul becomes Guru walle it embarks on its spiritual journey and reaches the chautha padh. The rest of the padhs follow depending on a person's karma, dilligence, discipline and determination. Without Amrit, Gur Prasad, all spiritual efforts are = Manmat and wasted. Results = Amrit and Effort. You just have to add one and one together to work out the rest.

We had in depth discussion on 52 hakums topic in detail at our sikhawareness forum: http://www.sikhawareness.com/topic/16221-authencity-of-52-hakums-of-sri-guru-gobind-singh-ji-split-topic-discussion/?do=findComment&comment=143130

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Personally, I think it was a pragmatic idea to increase our numbers. That only happens if Sikhs marry Sikhs. Of course, there's going to be theological interpretations about what the hukam signified, but looking back at the era the hukam was established and the state of Sikh society at the time, it had to be a method of encouraging the growth of Sikh numbers.

Why are the Pappus allowing them to marry in the Sikh Gurudwarehs when the ban has been imposed by their leaders? The Pappus need to go back to Sikh Darmsallas to learn Sikheee. I blame their food. They are eating too many dead animals, responsible for clouding their ability to think clearly. We are what we eat. The Pappus of the Sikh realm are over indulging in rajasic and tamasic foodstuffs, when they should really be consuming only sattvic diet. What they fail to understand is the fact, that it is COMPLETELY and TOTALLY and 100% IMPOSSIBLE to imbibe Sikheee unless they consume sattvic diet. Sikheee compliments sattvic diet and vice versa. Sattvic diet is the only way to go. Sharaab and tabakko are also COMPLETELY, TOTALLY and one 100% forbidden and there are no if(s), but(s), why(s) or when(s) about it. Either you follow Sikhee or you don't. Sikheee is not about picking and choosing. Sikhee is about LEARNING,FOLLOWING,ABSORBING and FINALLY MERGING WITH THE Akaal Purakh. The choice is yours. Either you are a loser, which most Pappus are, or a gainer, which most good people are.

Check with this link u can read 1000s of personal NDE experiences in the world http://www.nderf.org/NDERF/NDE_Archives/archives_First_half_2014.htm

it took me a while to find this in my diary but here it is .... this was just a poem which randomly came to my head when I heard a speech by Jathedar Mal Singh ji about the Beadbi of Guru Granth Sahib ji's saroop.... They were saying that we should be ashamed of ourselves k koi saddeh Guru nu mitti da tehl pa ke agan peth kar deve and we can still get to sleep at night? ..... I was so touched by their words and embarrassed to call myself a Sikh as I too just simply went to sleep, but that night I didn't , I stayed up and thought about this poem- ki saddi zameer mukh gayi, ki sadi anakh wali soch sukh gayi ? lokha de hakh jo dawonda c khalsa, ajj apne hakka layi dar-dar appeala pounda khalsa, jehre desh layi sadde gurra ne khud nu vaar ta, ajj ohna ne hi sada akaal roop granth saar ta jail'a vich band karke rakh laye saddi kaum di ankhi sher kehra chadda'veh ohna nu, kon hai ehna daler ? Bhai Gurbaksh Singh ji a bête la ke pukh hartaal Dasso kehre leader'a nu a fikar, kehne kitti ohna di puch partaal? sikho! kehra mooh leh ke jaavo geh Dasmeh pitta kol? kivveh dassugeh, ki ohna de updesha nu ditta tusi rol? dikha ditta tusi duniya nu, k jehre guru ne chirriya toh baaz si tharaye ajj ohda hi Sikh pull geya, apni sardari kivveh bachaye? utho, jaago sikho, haje v waqt hai saambh loh apne peo di pagg nu khalsa hajjeh vi chardikala vich jeoda hai, dikha deo jagg nu! Bhul chuk maaf karni Waheguru ji ka khalsa Waheguru ji ki Fathe

Chatanga I think you recognize me well. In past I have ripped/abused all the Dasam Granth Sahib haters and missionaries all my past posts are here. As one of the posters mentioned I am here since 2006 all my past posts would be in favour of what you of GPS or Akalifauj is writing today. They are just like my mirror image. I would have abused more gave negative feedback if someone has exactly posted what I have posted in 2006 - 07. I was 20 years old just had santheya of Prachin panth parkash suraj parkash nanak parkash etc. For me only Budhadal was greatest rest all were RSS agents. But today I am 31 years old and in last 5 years I stopped posting here. I was learning Guru Granth Sahibs bani and today I just cant follow this bhed chall of abusing. Today I see Sikh kaum far greater then budhadal or nihang singhs. 90% of individuals have no knowledge about Dasam Granth but the chose either to love it or hate it just based on their circle and certain articles and they are fighting over it. To be short today my take on Dhunda has great knowledge of Guru Granth Sahib we have to agree with it. He speaks about social evils derawad. In one of the video he talks about show me any gurudwara dera sant baba which does ardas for baby girl. It hit me in my brain. So he has certain qualities and he is questioning certain things. Why should we not acknowledge good qualities of every individual we have in panth. Will not it bring together the panth which is above all. Now in the above video posted he questioned Hemkunth Sahib with a quote from Guru Granth Sahib that which has a word to word meaning ke Paharan te sidh beth ke apna janam gawa rahe hai te guru Gobind Singh kiddan pahar te beth ke bhagti kar sakde hai. What would be its better reply to answer him based on Guru Granth sahib bani or shut him up and abuse him ? Guru Nanak Sahibs full bani is based on geyan charcha. Mecca gaye sidha koll gaye every where there were question answers. But today people get offend when asked anything which questions there imagination. Missionaries are RSS agents if you question this you will become RSS agent as well for many here.

Are human's charged when they kill millions of animals just to make a nice house? You display animals natural habitat for you luxuries. What about the fact you kill hundreds of insects by walking. All the natural lands destroyed just so you can have a steel car to drive for a vacation? Using mice as test subjects for your luxury of health??? You steal the food of animals for your own consumption. Humans have rapped the planet and continue to do so. According to your rationale of God, humans are serial killers. They don't think for a second when stepping on a poor insect. How many rats have you killed because they came into your luxury home? How many ants and flies have you killed for the same reason? Humans are murders. So how can you judge the God you perceive him to be, when you are no better than him? How many times have you stopped yourself from killing the insects with your foot? If you eat animals, can you explains to me why you condone the butchering of animals. Is this not murder? Is this not deliberate, conscious act of murder? According to your rationale, you should not exist because you are not compassionate and such humans are made up to control animals, insects and manipulate them.

Still stuck on popularity contests? I believe we should be able to see who is clicking the rating button. It will give a better understanding of who is doing it and why based on their previous post. Say for example a trump supporter is having a trump moment on this site. We know not to care and let him get off on his self destructive ways. If it's a well respected poster who stands by Gurbani. Then the person can acknowledge it and ask why and maybe even learn from it. Maybe there was a misunderstanding on the readers part. It can be a helpful tool. Right now it's a keyboard warriors way of getting back at posters they don't like anonymously.

Why don't you do a search on Google and on this site for this irrelevant information you are asking for in this topic.

Panthpreet and dhunda violate Akal Takht sahib maryada every time they have said Sri Dasam Granth Sahib ji is not Sri Guru Gobind Singh ji bani and is a panthic issue.

This poster has been a member of this forum since June of 2006. He has written 2438 post in a time period of ten years. This shows he's been exposed to the information regarding dhunda and Panthpreet which he is asking for. I don't buy this naive act for one Second. Anyone who is inclined to find out about dhunda and Panthpreet can simply do a youtube search with the relevant terms. Being a troll on this site has not helped this poster in the past. Won't help him today either.

I agree with you 100% Dhunda is wrong here because he never get a chance to feel naam simran. I know many parcharaks they speak a lot about naam simren but in reality they havent experienced it as well. My whole point it no one is perfect if you and me agree on just one thing out of 10 why not we create and make a bond around. Why when 2 sikhs sit together we discuss things which we dont agree upon when there are many we agree upon. And Guru Granth Sahib says ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਈਐ ਜਿਸ ਨਉ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਕਰੇ ਰਜਾਇ . If people like dhunda dont know naam simren and speaks against it whats our duty as a sikh to hate them, issue our "not a sikh" certificates or help him out ? ਹਰਿ ਕਾ ਨਾਮੁ ਮਨਿ ਵਸੈ ਹਉਮੈ ਕ੍ਰੋਧੁ ਨਿਵਾਰਿ ॥ If we are standing in favour of naam simran with anger and ego then dhunda is right we are parrots.